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Swanage Railway General Discussion

Discussion in 'Heritage Railways & Centres in the UK' started by Rumpole, Oct 10, 2012.

  1. Steve1015

    Steve1015 Member

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    Fact: M7 very tired and worn out. 31806 on wash out. 80104 failed with super heater tube blowing. 33012 on exam.....thankfully we have 33111 and 2 x 350's
     
  2. 30854

    30854 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Aye...... if only there was another M7 sitting around idle, Eh?
     
  3. Mogul

    Mogul Member

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    Summed it up perfectly. To be comfortable Swanage needs 5 'in ticket' locos on the branch. Our maximum 'normal' service days see 3 in steam. Two on the service trains and one on the dinner. Five allows one to be in washout with another as spare. In low season one can come out for valve & piston exams, intermediate work, be hired out, etc and we can still cover all services with one spare. This has stood us well for years and it was rare for Swanage to have to put diesel out on a steam service.
    Due to various unforseen circumstances we we entered the high season with just two and a half locos (53 on light duty). When the rough shunt took out 104 and 34070 right at the beginning of the high season we were left in a difficult position from which we are still recovering.

    The Wareham extension allows us to operate an additional train. Notionally one in each section. This could be a Wareham service or a driver experience for example. If this proved viable it could drive a requirement for a larger operational fleet. Boiler tickets tick away wether a loco is busy earning revenue or not so it doesn't pay to have too many locos standing around waiting for work.
    .,
     
  4. 007

    007 Member

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    It's all very well talking about not having a larger loco fleet when the steam service is decimated.

    6 locos minimum going forward.
     
  5. Mogul

    Mogul Member

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    I know you're just kidding but there is an important point here.

    The issue isn't the availability of locomotives. Its the availability of working locomotives and therefore the availability of the money, skills, engineering and other resources required to get them and keep them working.

    During August Swanage had 31625, 30120, 34070, 80106, 30053 on its metals and 31806 & 257 squadron close to ready in the works and yet on some days couldn't field a single working steam locomotive from that pool of 7. Two others eddystone and 31874 are in heavy overhaul.
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2017
  6. 30854

    30854 Resident of Nat Pres

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    You neglected to mention 563!

    On a more serious note however, the situation at Swanage seems the same as recently on the NYMR and to a lesser extent (as they at least had some small locos which could shift services double headed) on the Bluebell.

    It's been very refreshing to see increasing levels of collective action between owners of locos sharing common components. Prime examples being those amongst BR Standard and Bulleid Pacific owners. IIRC even an A1x Terrier cylinder block casting found it's way to a new home recently. Naturally, this approach only bears fruit where multiple preserved locos share common components, but where sufficient of a line's stock fall into this category, it clearly demonstrates that assets held in the form of hard metal are every bit as important as those held in bank accounts.

    Though we sometimes like to hide from vulgar financial issues, the bottom line is that, 99% of the time, heritage operations aren't the most reliable way of making money..... although this may be a slight understatement (!). Coupling the vast unfillable money pit of ancient and therefore less than totally reliable machinery to the necessity of providing reliable timetabled services throws up some 'interesting' challenges, to put it mildly!

    The only real answer lies in effective management of motive power on hand, by ensuring a core of the more reliable workhorses are subject to a quasi-commercial approach to scheduled repair cycles, leaving maintenance of those lovely idiosyncratic jewels of railway fleets to be managed around the workshop's main timetable. There are too many factors applicable to make any hard and fast suggestions across the board, but looser understandings and agreements could move matters forwards.

    Facilities and availability of suitably qualified staff vary wildly from line to line, as do reputations for excellence... or otherwise. What, if anything, should be done to assist lines whose facilities fall short of the mark? To answer that, consider this question. Do we see our lines in isolation, or as an identifiable sector of the leisure industry? The answers to this one are likely to become less divergent in direct proportion to proximity to the HRA.

    It strikes me that we do have a pool of locos potentially able to mitigate the worst effects of, shall we call it, unplanned shortages. In the 'small industrial loco' category, Bagnall, Barclay and Peckett products dominate available 0-4-0st, next up, Hunslet 'Austerity' 0-6-0st and more than a few ex-GW 0-6-0pt which can handle all bar the heaviest services on most lines, thereafter, we're heading into 'Big Chuffer' territory, where BR Standards, principally 4MT and 9F types best fit the bill. Note that "Headliner" express locos are absent from my list.... patience please.... all will become obvious.

    The stars of the mainline are already, to a great extent, covered by the need to conform to any number of extra requirements, which already leads to necessary cooperation amongst owners, but I'm thinking here of the bread and butter backbone of individual heritage lines.

    My thought is that, other than lines with a less than glowing reputation for loco management, the ideal loan locos would be those well known throughout the heritage sector. They are, by definition, those whose loan would be least contentious, those most easily maintained and with which more footplate crews would be familiar. If, over time, priority could be given to overhauling locos falling into these catergories, a nucleus of readily loanable kit would form.

    This already happens to an extent, but wouldn't it benefit all responsible lines to have a pool of working locos of known characteristics where much of the difficulty in deciding what, if anything, can be spared at need is covered by previously agreed loan arrangements? In this case, what's being suggested is a co-operative "register" of locos which a line would consider for loan, only to lines where standard of care can be reasonably assured by establishing agreed standards for use and maintenance. This seems a logical extension of much which already happens and would serve to drive up standards, where needed, across the heritage sector. It would also mean workshops concentrating on known reliable designs and although this may have a short term downside for certain much loved lone survivors, over the loger term, would free up capacity to concentrate efforts on such locos. Note too, that I suggest nothing to prevent dedicated groups from planning, funding and carrying out one-off restorations of yer actual "Bellerophons" or Radial Tanks. It simply recognises the reality that such machines are the icing on the cake.

    There will always be times when sod's law decrees one or more locos falls prey to some unforseeable malady, and Swanage has been singularly unfortunate in that depeartment this summer. Last year, it was the NYMR's turn and the Severn Valley have had their share of loco availability issues too. Preservationists are an imagininative bunch, with a solid core of very practically minded and highly skilled folk at the sharp end. My suggestions aren't aimed at regimentation, but at using what the sector already has more effectively, to free up time and capacity to ensure the trains keep running and that there's ultimately a better chance for the "Mardy Monsters" and Beattie Well Tanks to shine. Who knows..... perhaps even the Wainwright "D", lying cold these past six decades might get that new crank axle, or the Tennant "E5" might steam up the Aln Valley one day.
     
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  7. Martin Perry

    Martin Perry Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator Friend

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    Seems like a remarkably complex take on an issue that at present usually is answered by a CME picking up the phone/sending an email to his opposite number elsewhere asking if they have anything available for hire.
     
  8. 30854

    30854 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Well that's that sorted then.
     
  9. Gladiator 5076

    Gladiator 5076 Part of the furniture

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    I just wonder where this pool of, shall we call them Thunderbird locos, are?

    Camelot for example seems not be going to the planned WSR due to "paperwork issues".

    Anything is possible as we know but the WSR & NYMR have both had "diesel days" this summer from watching their webcams, so maybe they & other lines want to have a pool of back ups of their own, not loan them out.
     
  10. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    And at present the likely answer is 'Sorry, but we're short ourselves. I was just about to phone you with a similar request.'
     
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  11. twr12

    twr12 Well-Known Member

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    Too true!
     
  12. ady

    ady Well-Known Member

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  13. Pugwash

    Pugwash New Member

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    Opinions Differ. A bit like linking global warming to a particular hurricane, a direct cause and effect is difficult to prove but when all the management focus, spare funds and effort is directed in one area it's easy to imagine that an unprecedented and avoidable failure in another might not be unconnected.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2017
  14. LC2

    LC2 Member

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    Seems a bit unfair to me. You can't blame a bit of unco-ordinated shunting on the push for Wareham.
    Like it as not, the reason for the steam shortage is the shunting incident. Without that, you would have 2 more locos in steam which would be enough to rest 30053 whenever needed and to allow the u-boat's teething troubles to be resolved.
     
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  15. WishIHadAName

    WishIHadAName New Member

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    You can blame a super heater tube on the rough shunt.
     
  16. Pugwash

    Pugwash New Member

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    The shunt, no but the 'decision' to enter peek season with half the normal number of working locos?
    As I said direct cause and effect is difficult to link but there could be underlying contributing factors.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2017
  17. blackfour

    blackfour New Member

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    Just a series of unfortunate events, nothing more. The Swanage is a very well run, professional outfit. I lived in Swanage between 2015 and 2017, and was unfortunate enough to suffer an accident which restricted my mobility. Upon regaining my mobility to a limited extent one of my first destinations was the Swanage Railway, and I found their approach to me was professional, open and friendly. They have worked very, very hard to achieve their Wareham vision, and to pick fault with them over an incident that could happen to any railway? Smacks of sour grapes to me! I sincerely hope that the locomotive issues are sorted quickly, and the Swanage is back to full strength soon.
     
  18. ady

    ady Well-Known Member

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    The reason why they only had 'Manston', 80104 and 30053 was in part due to the fact that 31806 was away for a (what I think they call) mid term overhaul. Also, the overhauls of 31874 and '257 Squadron' have been delayed due the boilers which were being overhauled by an outside contractor. These factors have nothing to do with the Wareham service, or the arrival of the T3.
     
  19. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    So, what was the alternative? To cancel peak season? Not sure how you do that. To bring in other steam locos? Please tell both Swanage and me where these mythical locos are. The Wareham trains did not require any steam locos to my knowledge and were operated by an external organisation.
     
  20. ady

    ady Well-Known Member

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    [deleted due to it being repeated]
     
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2017

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