MK1's coaches vs other stock

If some of the recent MKI restorations I'm aware of are anything to go by, given sufficient interest and funding, we should be able to enjoy/hate* MKIs for the rest of our lifetimes.

Looking at the work the IWSR have had carried out on pre-grouping carriage frames, which have suffered badly from being used up and down Ryde Pier for decades, it'll take more than a bit of rust to write a carriage off. It's a question of how much MKIs are valued.

There will be generations to come who might wonder why the current survivors in need of serious TLC weren't regarded more highly. Every preserved heritage item, from stately home to TSO, is effectively held in trust for the future. Whilst there clearly comes a point where something has to be pretty damned special if ever-scarce funds are to be chucked at it, our own personal views shouldn't be the sole arbiter of what gets scrapped and what gets saved.

*take your pick

 

We should always be able to hate or enjoy mk 1s, there just won't be as many of them in the future.

Sawdust.

 

Something common to all of us, too!

 

I can't imagine that many existing mark ones will be scrapped in the future. There are so many railways crying out for stock that even the poorest examples will eventually be restored, although at great expense. How many of these coaches have been for sale recently ? The answer is virtually none, because owners are hanging on to them.

Bob.

 

Indeed, the only place we've bought Mk1s in recent years have been 3 off of a mainline company, a source I can see growing in years to come as Mk1s are gradually elbowed off the national network.

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

 

They were just fantastically reliable, the service was never massively overcrowded, and it was only an 8 mile run. You could literally set your watch by them, in all the years I used that service, from being a kid in the 60s, right through to the late 80s, for work and school, I was never once late, or stranded. Now that the Manchester-Bury line is part of Metrolink, that, sadly, no longer applies.

 

You missed out two equally interesting experiences. . With a 2EPB driving trailer leading hitting the junction at Nunhead at speed. The junction is straight for Greenwich now the Lewisham line and a curve for trains approaching from Catford. You would think the junction was laid using a 5opence piece

The other experience was an evening departure from Cannon St formed 4CEP, 4CEP, 4EPB first stop Tonbridge. The EPB was detached at Tonbridge to form a Maidstone train. The ride downhill from Knockholt through Sevenoaks was shall we say rather lively if in the rear of the EPB

 

On the 504s between Manchester and Bury you did have the advantage of no junctions after Queens Road at the Manchester end. Also the stations were closely spaced so not much opportunity for fast running, apart from Whitefield - Radcliffe - Bury Bolton Street. The bit between Whitefield and Radcliffe was down a quite steep gradient and straight until the right hand curve across the viaduct to Radcliffe Central, here they did used to get up to about 65 ish, and if the trailer was leading, it could bounce.

 

I'm a lot less familiar with the lines to Tonbridge, but I doubt anything much over 40 was acheivable on the Woolwich or Eltham lines west of Dartford. That's not to say we dreamed of 65... the ride of the EPBs was "lively" enough as it was! The odd VEP made it through Woolwich Arsenal on Chatham services... eee - sheer luxury! On the EPBs, during busy times, I preferred travelling in an empty guard's compartment to the cattle truck conditions in the rest of the train!

Poor ride seems to have been down to track on the Dartford lines, as I rode 2EPBs and 2HAP units on the Waterloo - Reading line. Both types ran coupled to 4VEPs and weren't too bad.
,

 

Knockholt to Tonbridge is a long downhill section where speeds in the 80s were common. There were a batch of 4EPB with mainline gearing and one of those was supposed to work the service.

 

Similar situation to classic cars really. Even very poor ones, which years ago would have been scrapped are now being restored.

 

Yes, I can remember a number of "classic" cars when they were new(ish) What they need is a match setting to them! I won't draw a comparison with a certain type of railway carriage now the East Lancs has also had a vandal attack.

PH

 

Scrapped? Disintegrated! I managed a service station between 1978 and 83, and can say, hand on heart, that more modern 20 year old car lasts far better than a 5 year old car did back then! I challenge anyone to tell me a Vauxhall Cresta or Morris Marina (or any number of other number of efforts!) in any way qualifies as a classic. They were rubbish then and they're rubbish now! Even my old boss's 1973 5.3 Jag spent more time under repair than on the road, and wouldn't have lasted long, had he not owned his own workshop business!

No, cars then were, on the whole, every bit as unreliable as many BR first generation diesel locos. (Phew.... crowbarred it back to railway related. Just!!

 

You are 200% right. The nineteen fifties were a very bad time for motor design just as they were IMHO for railway coaching stock, at least aesthetically.

Paul H

 

Modern cars are much more rust resistant and reliable than cars from that era, I cant argue, but they are also as boring and dull as it is possible to be.

 

Very variable.

PH

 

I put them in the same category as modern trains and buses. Efficient and reliable but utterly charachterless. I know nothing about them and have no interest in them, as with modern trains. I hear people talking about class 444s or 350s etc and I haven't got the first clue what any of them are

 

Putting a slightly different spin on this, while the C&W tell me that the MK1 design makes them more expensive to do body repairs than others (I don't do coaches I am only reporting what our lads say) speaking as a guard, the BR standard coaches with their in swinging guards doors, slam-lock door handles, separate guards compartment, effective heating, and bucket seat for the guard, are a superb design.

 

Very valid things to point out (thanks for this). Would point out in turn that such things can be found in pre-grouping non-corridor stock although the seats are of a different shape.

Paul H

 

Not necessarily all on the same coach though.