How far on a tender of water?

Most mainline steam loco water stops are planned for about 70 miles. Which usually gives a good safety margin of 1/4 tender. As watering is always done by tanker and pump, with flow restricted by the hose, more time can be lost with extended water stops, to put more water in each time, than could be saved by dropping one water stop per trip.

 

How can I say this tactfully:
No.
If flow rate is restricted by the hose diameter then that flow rate is constant, so it takes as much time to pump 4000 gals 3 times as 3000gals 4 times. However doubtless lots of other operational issues complicate the decisions.

 

When 4771 Green Arrow ran short of water approaching Garsdale the subsequent inquiry revealed that Railtrack / Network rail works on 72 miles per tender fill of water (presumably of 4000 gallon capacity) but - in response to water capacity of 60163 - 60163's tender was re-designed to carry more water albeit at the expense of coal capacity although I am unaware of the actual current coal / water capacities.

The other factor "learned" from the Green Arrow incident was that the 72 mile figure can vary according to such factors as slipping, driver handling, load factors etc. A good example of this in practice was the Haymarket driver skills when ECML services were diverted via the Waverley route during the 1948 floods and still managed to maintain non-stop working despite the lack of water troughs on the diversion route.

 

In his book 'Ace Enginemen', Norman McKillop recalls Gateshead driver Bill Hogarth receiving a letter from his superintendent thanking him for working an A4 hauling 14 bogies from Grantham to Newcastle without taking water, describing it as 'a good performance'.

 

Search the archives for Bob Meanley's account of The Bristolian non-stop run in 2010. IIRC, continuous running at moderate and high speeds, and therefore with few periods of sustained acceleration, meant that water consumption was significantly lower (about half?) than a normal rail-tour. Of course, they couldn't be sure of such a good path, so had to carry enough for a "normal" run, just in case.

 

There was a run over the S&C northbound a few years ago with 45407 that missed out the water stop at Appleby as the crew reckoned there was enough water to get them to Carlisle. I can't remember where the previous water stop was, but I seem to recall it was in the region of 110 miles without water, and it was with a decent load, at least 10 coaches. I'll try and find the details on Six Bells Junction.

Edit - may have been October 2000. Took water at Blackburn, then ran non-stop to Carlisle, around 100 miles. Running time was just under 3 hours.

 

The Midland Railway used to run daily from the troughs south of Trent to Liverpool, some 113 miles I believe.

 

From top up in Southall Tornado regularly arrived in the DGL at Grantham with 1000 to 1500 gallons left in tender of 6250 gallons capacity. Fastest top up enroute that I experienced was 3.5 minutes courtesy Bells and Two Tones and a quick acting support crew.

 

I read somewhere that in the 1930s, there was a Waterloo-Bournemouth non-stop worked by a Schools class - 108 miles without a stop for water and not the largest of tenders either. Others may know more about this.

 

i am rather surprised that no one has mentioned the currently topical case of Bulleid Pacific 'Winston Churchill' hauling the funeral train from waterloo to handborough in january 1965 - equivalent to a non stop run to salisbury, and water was a concern (water wasnt taken until the loco got to oxford depot around 4pm -some 3 hours after the loco must have left nine elms). this has been described by jim lester fireman on that special memorable day.

cheers,
julian

 

I seem to recall on the Cheltenham Flyer, although 5043 had the Water GUV in the train, given the non stop runs, much of which at decent speed, it used less than the tender's capacity without the GUV's additional supply.

Water pressure can make a big difference, on a couple of recent tours the pressure from the Hydrant on Crewe plat 12 has been naff.

 

I think that we would need to restore Midland Railway 118 to working order. These locomotives were reputed to be able to run on 20-21lb of coal to the mile on light trains. I don't have any water consumption figures as coal consumption was always more important to the railway's finances but I suspect that their original 4,000 gallon tenders would take them 200 miles or so.

 

Evening folks,

Loosely on subject, apparently the crew of 15XX No. 1501 had to drop the fire at Swithland today, due to low water...

Very Best Wishes,
Bob.

 

Oh dear any more info forthcoming?

 

And why only one tender? According to the BBC, 1960s steam locos had five or more ...
https://www.national-preservation.com/threads/rare-sighting-of-multi-tender-steam-loco.434709/