RTC daytrips 2013

Not much stopping it apart from the usual caveats of gauging/pathing, turning on the Hove/Preston Park triangle and a few options (Battersea loop nearest ?) at the London end, might need a Diesel tailgunner however with the reversals into and out of terminus platforms unless your trains airbraked and you can "borrow" the Lovers Walk 09, could go via Lewes to reverse in one direction if plat 3 at Brighton was unavailable as a side of the triangle.

 

I remember going to see 45407 (when running as 45157) doing something like this in 2001. The Brighton Breezy tours which I think involved a few trips between Victoria and Brighton, turning via Lewes. Sadly that day 45407 failed on one of the trips. I think Daylight Railtours also ran a tour with the same name with 34016 but don't think it did multiple trips.

 

A question for Jamesquared - how long before Kingscote North box is comissioned. I presume it will interface with NR and the issue of having to drive tokens about by road and the Bluebell/NR groundframe can be removed.

 

I think these are two separate issues that aren't necessarily related.

The token issue is because effectively, once a token leaves Kingscote, the only place it can return (currently) is to Kingscote. So there is no possibility of a train leaving the Bluebell, or entering, without the token being taken either from or to Kingscote by road. As an example, for an outgoing train, once it "disappears" from the Bluebell at EG, the token is left stranded and nothing else can move on that section of line until it is returned to Kingscote. So currently it has to go by road.

I'm not sure there are really detailed plans yet (or at least not publicly available) but I think the full commissioning of the Kingscote North Box will provide for a token machine at EG. That would allow two trains to follow in the same direction through the KC/EG section, so potentially allowing, for example, an incoming train to pick up a token at EG from the machine at EG, without the need to have it travel by road. Theoretically at least that should allow trains to enter / leave the Bluebell in a rather narrower time window than currently (see discussions we have previously had about the length of time required) so, for example, it would be easier to accept an incoming / outgoing service on a two-train day, which is almost impossible at the moment.

The other issue is the interface with NR. Currently, that is I believe basically a manual process, i.e. we need a NR person to unlock the gates (there are two padlocks with each railway holding one key I think, so neither railway can unilaterally unlock them). The Bluebell token is then used to release the south ground frame and set the road, but thereafter the control of the train passing between the two railways is by verbal authorisation between Oxted box and the Bluebell person in charge of the movement at EG. I don't think there is anything in the Kingscote resignalling that requires that to change; in any case, eventually AIUI signalling at Oxted will be subsumed in the regional signalling centre at Redhill. Whether NR want a more interlocked procedure I don't know, I'd imagine it would depend just how much traffic ends up passing between the two. There has been a surprising amount this year, but I guess there is a "newness" factor, though interestingly we are currently storing some railhead treatment vehicles on behalf of NR that will eventually have to leave via the EG connection! (See Bluebell Matters thread).

Tom

 

Tom - I still dont know how our S&T got our facility on SVR. to all intents and purposes Kidderminster Town (SVR) box is a fringe box of West Midlands Signalling Centre. Our inter;ocking is connected to theirs so any move from NR to SVR and vice versa is a signalled move, Pulling a lever in KD Town releases the road to NR who set the road. Authorisation to procede to SVR is given by fixed signals from either platform ar Kidderminster NR and from SVR by a colour light signal at the exit from SVR. For shunt moves within SVR KD T can clear a position light to access C&W. To stop inadvertent moves out of C&W point motor operated derailers are provided and interlocked with the signalling.

When the special leaves us for you on 2 Nov it will be able to procede straight on to NR. We do have another advantage there is no token to hand over as Bewdley - Kidderminster is track circuit tokenless block. P erhaps when the NR signalling is upgraded you might get a similar set up.

The views expressed above are personal and are not authorised by any organisation I may belong to

 

Times for Bluebell Special on 2 Nov are on Real Time Trains. Nothing for the ECS workings yet

 

Arrive East Grinstead siding 14:13 and Depart on the return 16:33 - enough for a trip to Sheffield Park and back with a short break.

Links to times http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/U54616/2013/11/02/advanced and http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/U54615/2013/11/02/advanced

 

According to RTC website arrive Sheffield Park 15:05 depart 15:35 link - http://www.railwaytouring.net/uk-day-trips/blue-bell-explorer

 

That's going to be a pretty tight turn-round at SP, especially allowing for a long train meaning a more complex shunt at SP. Good job there is no need to service the steam engine in that time, since it can't be more than about 45 minutes at SP between arrival and departure...

The Bluebell is running a revised timetable that day (presumably to fit in around the charter on what is a two-train day for us). See http://www.bluebell-railway.com/file/115/november-timetables-2nd.pdf (which just has the Bluebell trains, but it is easy to see where the charter will fit).

Edit: Paul beat me to the punch. Only 30 minutes at SP! Scarcely time for a cup of coffee if working on Bessemer time...

Tom

 

46 minutes Bewdley to Kidderminster? For all the will in the world. It only takes 10 minutes. I guess it will sit on Kidderminster SVR side and then appear.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if the loco comes off and takes water at Kidderminster before going onto the mainline.

 

I'd be surprised if it does do that! A Brit with a 4000g tender wont need water after 16 miles.

 

Surely better to stop under the tower at the end of plat 2/3 at Bewdley for that ?, even if late on the SVR leg, it would still be presented to NR in the correct slot.

The thing is the Brit woulden't need water after 16 miles, but it's how far the next water stop on NR is, topping up at the southern end of the SVR could be the difference in range.

Where does it actually take water on that itinery anyway ?, longest stop is Birmingham International, but I thought the hydrant there was on plat 1, not 5 ?.

 

From the details on RTC's website. It mentions Rugby as a water stop. But it also mentions the train will leave Bridgnorth around 0730. Yet have put timings of 0620.

A quick edit. Times are shown on RTT for Kidderminster SVR 0749 dep. Kidderminster NR 0753-0756.

 

I agree the - Bewdley - Kidderminster section time looks long, usually 11 min. Even if it did come off to take water it should not take 35 mins. The return journey is diesel hauled and that is booked for 24 min and that wont be taking water. Seems a bit odd but clarification will only come with release of WTT and Trafic notice

 

Any idea how long 70013 stays at the Bluebell before (I assume) heading back to London?

 

Last I heard....it's going on the back of the train as far as Acton and then to Southall but like everything else on the railways....subject to change

 

There is a 7 minute stop at Acton Lane reception sidings on the return.

 

RTC blurb on the website (as opposed to timings) mentioned water being taken on at Hemel Hempstead.

 

Water being taken Rugby and Bushey according to timings now up at UKsteam (http://www.uksteam.info/tours/t13/t1102b.htm). I am aware it won't need water after 16 miles (!) but as said above, water won't be available again until Rugby ay 09:53, so the crew would probably prefer a top up before heading out up Old Hill bank. Perhaps time to open a specific thread now for this tour? Ticket has arrived via email, I am looking forward to this.