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Project Wareham

Discussion in 'Heritage Railways & Centres in the UK' started by David R, Jul 31, 2015.

  1. 35B

    35B Nat Pres stalwart

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    From someone who's booked much passenger assistance, believe me when I say that the law does not require operators to extend a timetabled service to go beyond the point at which it's scheduled to terminate. If the train is booked to terminate at Corfe, then that is where it will terminate. What the law does provide for is a minimum (sometimes very minimal!) standard of service to allow the disabled to access public transport services. Any exception that may apply to the Swanage Railway from the ORR scheme would be to do with the SR's not being a mainline service operator - as mentioned before, the NYMR also runs over Network Rail but isn't to the best of my knowledge part of the formal Passenger Assist network.
     
  2. Cuckoo Line

    Cuckoo Line Member

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    All it seems to be doing is making sure that the option is not closed to them for some point in the future if that extension would move up their priority list. Generally they seem to have some order in their priorities and there are more pressing ones than that, but they have a team to keep an eye on things to ensure the possibility is maintained.
     
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  3. DcB

    DcB Well-Known Member

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    the SR does have a policy
    https://www.swanagerailway.co.uk/accessibility
    "A ramp is available at all stations to provide wheelchair access to trains, and our friendly platform staff and train crews will be happy to assist."
    Presumably will be updated with input from SWR and NR if the SR run trains from Wareham to either Corfe (with a change) or direct to Swanage 2023?
    SR probably will confirm if the Wareham service will start or not in May 2023 in March 2023? (like they did this year in March).
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2022
  4. oliversbest

    oliversbest Member

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    Somebody,somewhere though it was important enough to publish,which is how aggregator NewsNowRail picked up. (Before the moles were awake!!)
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2022
  5. oliversbest

    oliversbest Member

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  6. oliversbest

    oliversbest Member

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    Lets hope those friendly staff have brollies to stop the punters from getting soaked at Corfe. Amenity services are called that for a reason and in this case its not to enable the SR in its steam endeavours. I do not think the pioneers envisaged Corfe being a terminus for the main line connector..With good will and cooperation it will work. Let good old commonsense rule. If the trial is an abject failure then it can be written off .The SR will not be doing this on its own one would think If a success then the SR will adapt to meet new challenges. The steam afficionados(Yes,I am one) will manfully face new realities. Whatever Swanage folk think of the SR,it is "their" railway and so however distant that green signal at Wareham might be. putting out the hope that it might someday be attained would be an unwise move. On the part of all interested bodies.. Bring on those trials and give them max publicity!
     
  7. Cuckoo Line

    Cuckoo Line Member

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    It's in the latest Bluebell times.
     
  8. oliversbest

    oliversbest Member

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    Yes,it is going to be a huge task but having seen the Bluebell get back into E. Grinstead across the viaduct Not impossible
    I was there when Kingscote was the end of the line. Another "impossible" task!!
    Go for it!
     
  9. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    AIUI, it is a “screening application”. That’s not a planning application itself, but a request to the planning authority to give an opinion on whether a full application will require an environmental impact assessment.

    As @Cuckoo Line says, it is really about keeping options open; in particular to maintain lease options on Lywood Tunnel. The railway is a long way from running trains, IMHO. Even less likely, running Bluebell trains right through to the mainline at Copyhold Junction and thence to Haywards Heath (the equivalent of the SR going past Worgret Junction through to Wareham) is a non-starter: if nothing else there are no paths and no platform capacity.

    Tom
     
  10. DcB

    DcB Well-Known Member

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    However with the SR going past Worgret Junction through to Wareham worked in 2017, the paths and platforms are still there and shown on the realtime website for 3 times a day,
    https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:C26798/2022-05-24/detailed
    so will still be OK in 2023 for the DMUs and SR volunteers, if SR and SWR does well this year to make it viable.
     
  11. Andy Moody

    Andy Moody Member

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    I think this has been mentioned before, You should take no notice of these pathways, When the time comes that OR&R grant the operating licence, Pathways will have to be negotiated with NR, as well as registering the class 117/121 DMMU's to carry passengers to/from Wareham.
    Hopefully this might happen latter this year (I hope) to allow SR traincrews to obtain Route Knowledge between Frome river bridge and Wareham station.
     
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  12. Shaggy

    Shaggy Part of the furniture

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    Not to be derisory to the Cambrian Heritage Railway but to compare what they have and offer to that Swanage do are miles apart. Their current set up is very small and the amount of track still in situ but not able to be used in the current set up is relatively vast. There are infrastructure issues that require upgrading before reopening to the public and although they are progressing with these, a comparable service to that offered by the SRT is a long way away. Basically there is almost a blank canvas to start from. A much better place to be than somewhere that is already established and operating successfully but would need all the investment put into it to upgrade it to a mainline compatible service.

    You mentioned the Rossendale study into the ELR. These studies are taking place all over the country. Another one in the south is the proposed reopening of the Marchwood branch along Southampton water to link Fawley with its ever increasing population to Southampton. Yes this is already Network Rail owned and the track, signalling, one station and crossings are already there so on paper it is an easy win, and one that would alleviate an awful lot of traffic from what is a very heavily congested road. Those proposing the project see all of this as a plus making it an easy win, but when you scratch beneath the surface, the cost to reinstate a passenger service that is comparable to the available subsidised bus and ferry services could easily top £100m. Anything less and you will be offering a slower, less attractive, more expensive operation that won't be used.

    The easiest and cheapest lines to reopen to commuter traffic in this day and age are those that basically have nothing left except a track bed and these are still notoriously expensive to build and at a time when alternative working arrangements are working successfully and the countries finances are being squeezed to breaking point, no local authority will take such a gamble.

    Apologies for the digression from the SRT.
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2022
  13. DcB

    DcB Well-Known Member

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    Thanks. Did some SR traincrews sit in with the WCR crews to Wareham during the 2017 trial?.
     
  14. Rumpole

    Rumpole Part of the furniture

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    All trains operated by third parties over SR infrastructure must have an SR Conductor Driver, who then must travel through to Wareham to deal with the SR token instrument.
     
  15. 61624

    61624 Part of the furniture

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    There you go with those negative waves....... Molehills!
     
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  16. Shaggy

    Shaggy Part of the furniture

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    I prefer to call them realistic, financially astute opinions based on the current economic crisis and UK working practices.
     
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  17. kwrail

    kwrail New Member

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    The proposal for the Fawley branch is a basic one, with a budget of £43 million. It would be a 30min DMU shuttle between Hythe and Southampton Central. Main tasks are to upgrade the line to 60mph running, close Marchwood box and put under the control of Eastleigh, build a new station at Hythe and refurbish Marchwood and automate two level crossings. It has a very strong cost-benefit figure (>4) and would all be under the control of NR/SWR.

    Which gives an idea of the sums involved for running a regular Wareham-Swanage shuttle - my guess is that for the Swanage branch the costs would be considerably more and I would doubt that the business case was anywhere near as strong. So although it is likely to remain a long term aim of the SR, in the short term the traffic on to the branch is going to be mainly charter trains, with a very limited number of scheduled trains (if any). The members of the SR have done a fantastic job getting the railway to where it is now and like Oliversbest are going to find this disappointing, but it is the current reality.
     
  18. oliversbest

    oliversbest Member

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    Let us see the numbers and results from the 2023 trials. or perhaps you would rather we didn't go through the motions?
     
  19. oliversbest

    oliversbest Member

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    Financially astute? With a crumbling Tory Party that spends billions on aircraft carriers and cannot recognise societal benefits staring at them?
    Unless you subscribe to the notion that all this "climate change" stuff is gobbledygook then priorities are going to be changing
    Again, to all the financial wizards and experts on transport economics who,whenever a scheme to "Restore Railways" is published come out with great helpings of negativity. A little support would be nice!
    This site is dedicated to railway preservation, does that mean that we do not want to see Railway progress.? This thread is entitled Project Wareham. It would seem that some would wish that the whole thing would just go away and SR can continue to end its world at Norden
    ....let us have the2023 trials,evaluated by qualified economists and by those who necessarily have to look beyond bottom lines in the area of public policy.
    I am sure that the 30 million spent on the Okehampton line revamp is not going to recouped in even a decade. So why was it done?
    First step in accepting that a better way to get to a national park area was available and for the benefit of all.
     
  20. 35B

    35B Nat Pres stalwart

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    Okehampton had diddly squat to do with access to Dartmoor, and everything to do with improving access to Exeter from the areas that look to the A30 for a drive east.

    As for Project Wareham, those economists can look all they like. But unless they have have money to feed into the project, their opinion may not be worth terribly much - there's no one in Dorset writing blank cheques.
     
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