If you register, you can do a lot more. And become an active part of our growing community. You'll have access to hidden forums, and enjoy the ability of replying and starting conversations.

West Somerset Railway General Discussion

Discussion in 'Heritage Railways & Centres in the UK' started by gwr4090, Nov 15, 2007.

  1. nick813

    nick813 Well-Known Member Loco Owner

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2010
    Messages:
    1,503
    Likes Received:
    1,503
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    poole dorset
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    worth a read:


    https://news.railbusinessdaily.com/wsr-launches-new-1-million-emergency-sos-survival-fund/
     
  2. Piggy

    Piggy Member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2020
    Messages:
    250
    Likes Received:
    327
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Somerset
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    It's Baldrick with another cunning plan .............. (thank you)
     
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2021
  3. Matt37401

    Matt37401 Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2014
    Messages:
    15,329
    Likes Received:
    11,666
    Occupation:
    Nosy aren’t you?
    Location:
    Nowhere
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    That was Baldrick who regularly had a cunning plan, they were never quite as cunning as a fox who’d just been appointed professor of cunning at Oxford University though :)
     
  4. RailWest

    RailWest Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2011
    Messages:
    3,803
    Likes Received:
    7,441
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    West Country
    Meanwhile AIUI the Plc takes on the cost of maintaining the station at Washford, yet that station apparently will remain closed until further notice and so no passengers will be using it.
     
  5. 5944

    5944 Resident of Nat Pres

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2006
    Messages:
    8,032
    Likes Received:
    7,607
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Train Maintainer for GTR at Hornsey
    Location:
    Letchworth
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Monkey Magic, ross, 35B and 2 others like this.
  6. Sidmouth

    Sidmouth Resident of Nat Pres Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2005
    Messages:
    9,635
    Likes Received:
    8,303
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Alderan !
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    much expanded from the previous announcement and press release . Still CRF bashing and interesting turned to MP who I don't think sees eye to eye with the railway . WSRA and WSRRT take note as you are expected to contribute too

    I like the we raised over a million (£900k ish) which came from the CRF, so we can do it again
     
    Pete Thornhill likes this.
  7. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2008
    Messages:
    26,103
    Likes Received:
    57,432
    Location:
    LBSC 215
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    The other confusing bit is that:

    "The WSR Plc Board is also actively researching the costs and feasibility of issuing another Share Issue appeal"
    whereas

    "the Plc Board decided recently too that it had no choice but to defer and pause any further developmental work and incurring costs on changing its structure and creating a new over-arching charity for the time being as suggested in last year’s Bailey Report."
    So spending money on a share issue is apparently OK, but not on a recommended restructure that is widely considered to be one of the keys to unlocking the potential for fundraising. Go figure ...

    Tom
     
    D1039, ghost, 3ABescot and 12 others like this.
  8. Sidmouth

    Sidmouth Resident of Nat Pres Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2005
    Messages:
    9,635
    Likes Received:
    8,303
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Alderan !
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    there is also a interpretation that we didn't get £430k so now we need a £1m
     
  9. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2013
    Messages:
    10,440
    Likes Received:
    17,941
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Cheltenham
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Not just a million pounds this year, but a million pounds every year thereafter!
     
  10. Sidmouth

    Sidmouth Resident of Nat Pres Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2005
    Messages:
    9,635
    Likes Received:
    8,303
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Alderan !
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    re reading

    “This additional CRFH money would have provided a vital, further financial lifeline needed for the railway’s survival, and we are confident that all of the projects we put forward for support were needed to help get the much-loved West Somerset Railway back up and running normally again."

    - so why are these projects and costings not called out as part of the current appeal ?

    “We are still receiving donations money every week because people believe so strongly in our railway. Long may that continue to be the case, and let’s try to raise the £1 million as soon as possible, maybe more! “It’s worth noting that we have now raised or received a total in financial help of an amazing £1.4 million from all sources to date since last March, so this appeal target is achievable!"

    - £13k so far says that is stretching the truth way beyond its limit

    “We now know that we are going to face a trading revenue shortfall this year anyway due to it being an enforced shorter operating season for us with severe restrictions on the number of trains, plus Covid 19 capacity issues and delays on the new Seaward Way level crossing, so we expect that the trading loss could be as high too, maybe £1 million."

    - yes covid is contributing but lack of seaward way is a real killer and that seems to having a far bigger impact than anticipated and depending on what you believe could have been avoided. I am curious about severe restrictions on the number of trains ....

    “We have to pay the bills from our suppliers, pay the wage bills for our dedicated staff, and try to generate as much revenue as we can in an impossibly short season with fewer trains and restricted passenger carrying capacity due to Covid restrictions. But we will get there in the end!

    - why is impossibly short . Railways lost Easter but have been able to run since then (subject to restrictions)

    3) The WSR plc will also seek the active support of both of its two support charities, the West Somerset Railway Association (WSRA) and the West Somerset Railway Heritage Trust (WSRHT) towards this appeal via targeted items of expenditure which can be made as part of their permitted support activities under charity law, and also taking advantage of Gift Aided donations.

    - Bad news WSRA and WSRRT , the collecting bowl is coming round , now be good and empty your pockets

    and finally

    ”Some good news is that we have had a good start since the 22 May limited re-opening, so I’m optimistic we can achieve all of this by pulling together hard, and going the final mile towards our recovery, and running over the full length of the railway again soon.”"

    - if in doubt , roll out the cliches , final mile (Dunster to Minehead ?)
     
    ghost, MellishR, 5944 and 2 others like this.
  11. RailWest

    RailWest Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2011
    Messages:
    3,803
    Likes Received:
    7,441
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    West Country
    Maybe the 'active researching' (presumably at nil or minimal cost?) will determine in due course that another Share Issue is not cost-effective and/or feasible after all? Will there be a Plan C ?
     
  12. Pete Thornhill

    Pete Thornhill Resident of Nat Pres Staff Member Administrator Moderator Friend

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2008
    Messages:
    7,498
    Likes Received:
    5,455
    I was just laughing at that bit myself, nearly two thirds came from one off grants which only came about from an extraordinary situation.

    Even the 1.4 million since last March is short of the monthly amount required to meet the target.
     
  13. Robin Moira White

    Robin Moira White Resident of Nat Pres

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2014
    Messages:
    11,247
    Likes Received:
    17,947
    Gender:
    Female
    Occupation:
    Barrister
    Location:
    Stogumber
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Certain legalities apply to making a share issue, or even inviting individuals to buy shares in a company. The word 'prospectus' may prove important.
     
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2021
    Kje7812, Spitfire, Paul42 and 4 others like this.
  14. staffordian

    staffordian Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2012
    Messages:
    1,501
    Likes Received:
    2,134
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    The Potteries
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    As already pointed out, money to thrown at any reorganisation is apparently in short supply, so any right thinking individual would soon realise that issuing additional shares is not a goer.

    Lets see.

    1) Issuing shares costs money. It also has ongoing costs involved because of the necessary admin and communications involved in keeping shareholders updated.

    2) Charity based reorganisation costs money. But it has almost immediate returns in opening more funding options and allowing tax efficient giving.

    So if option two is out of reach, option one is surely not even visible on the horizon, let alone out of reach...
     
    MellishR, Fish Plate, Paul42 and 3 others like this.
  15. 61624

    61624 Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2006
    Messages:
    5,294
    Likes Received:
    3,596
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    I have been involved with several share issues by small companies (not railway related) and they are a nightmare to prepare the legally required paperwork for - and costs are very high. Don't go that way!
     
    Sunnieboy, Paul42 and Jamessquared like this.
  16. 35B

    35B Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2011
    Messages:
    25,493
    Likes Received:
    23,730
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Grantham
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    We assume that the share issue in question will be a public issue. The hurdles may seem less intimidating if the fund raising is amongst a narrower circle, and there may be other perceived advantages to that approach which dilute the still considerable costs associated with it.
     
    jnc likes this.
  17. 6960 Raveningham Hall

    6960 Raveningham Hall Member Friend

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2016
    Messages:
    713
    Likes Received:
    1,033
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired.
    Location:
    Near St. Austell, Cornwall.
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    I completely accept your observations, simply because I know no better. I can see that if potential new shareholders were the target then that may be a problem.
    However, if the plan was to encourage existing shareholders to increase their shareholding (a situation which I took on at the start of the pandemic) would that be so problematic?
     
    Another Yorkshireman likes this.
  18. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2013
    Messages:
    10,440
    Likes Received:
    17,941
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Cheltenham
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    I think it'd be wildly optimistic to think asking your existing base to cough up more would be enough given the WSR to my knowledge has never raised even close to a million pounds before, it needs to find new sources of cash.
     
    Matt37401 likes this.
  19. 30854

    30854 Resident of Nat Pres

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2017
    Messages:
    12,172
    Likes Received:
    11,493
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Brighton&Hove
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Still not looking good down Minehead way, Eh? Am I the only outsider utterly bemused by events which, unless involving some some hidden agenda to rid the entire line of viable heritage operations, seems simply inexplicable?

    I've tried to remain resolutely impartial over past weeks (indeed, past months and years), but that stance is being rendered increasingly untenable with every utterance from a board who, to put it bluntly, seem to have lost the plot ... and that's the more charitable of two interpretations. Such good news as still comes from the WSR comes from the coal-face and seems to do so in spite of the board, not because of it.

    Nothing I've seen from the board comes close to outlining any coherent policy, if such exists, much less justifying a stance which looks guaranteed, if not actually intended, to alienate as large a cross section of the heritage community as possible. That's the very community to whom they now address unconvincingly vague appeals to chuck money into a pit of unknown size, with no detail as to precisely how such funds can be hoped to stave off an inevitable, if unwelcome conclusion.

    Concerning the frankly inexcusable behaviour in respect of the S&D Trust, the 'what' is far more evident than any 'why'. Ditto whatever is now going on with the QB, for so long a jewel in the WSR crown. In lieu of credible pronouncements, each time someone touches a nerve, we're treated to an unhelpful broadside. No structured, reasoned vision, merely petulant vitriol. I can speak for no other, but that does the opposite of reassuring me that the board has the slightest handle on whatever the true situation is and have demonstrated no reason for any misplaced hope that things are other than what they appear on the surface .... and that is "irredeemably shambolic".

    Last time I was on this thread, I opined that the staff, volunteers and supporters deserve far better, as indeed they do. They're sure as hell not getting that from the current WSR board, who IMHO need to pi##, or get off the potty, while there's still a railway to save.
     
  20. Pete Thornhill

    Pete Thornhill Resident of Nat Pres Staff Member Administrator Moderator Friend

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2008
    Messages:
    7,498
    Likes Received:
    5,455
    Maybe, but as I’ve also pointed out, it’s not just here that these views are being made, there have been several other places given as examples, where exactly the same criticism is being made of the appeal. Off the top of my head, there is the Facebook friends page, the comments to the ITV story @flying scotsman123 mentioned, WNXX forum @35B mentioned, to name just three. I am not the only one to of noticed the common theme, further evidence of which is the underwhelming appeal total, if all these people were wrong then that would be much higher.
     
    30854, ross, 35B and 1 other person like this.

Share This Page