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Recommissioning after Coronavirus

Discussion in 'Heritage Railways & Centres in the UK' started by johnofwessex, Mar 24, 2020.

  1. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    It seems to me only point of contention could be the use of open coaches. SVR have already concluded that the rules mean the Engine House at Highley can't open, which seems sensible, I'm sure other railways will conclude similarly with comparable things. But other than that it doesn't feel like we're stretching things, which I did feel some railways were doing a bit towards the end of last year.

    On a separate note, what about a return to general volunteering? Most railways are operating an essential work only policy, with varying definitions of "essential"! We seemed to take our cues from the "rule of six" last time, but that would suggest not returning until mid-May at the earliest, which doesn't feel right if we've decided it's safe to run trains. Has the HRA expressed an opinion on this aspect Steve? (And yes, I am getting bored stuck at home, my motives are entirely selfish! :) )
     
  2. ruddingtonrsh56

    ruddingtonrsh56 Member

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    I guess if railways are able to guarantee that each household group will be in their own compartment, one could make the case that while there is an indoor element, one would only ever be in this situation in the context of just your household group, the only time you would be 'exposed' to other household groups would be when you were outside, where the transmission risk is significantly reduced (Yes, this ignores things like corridors on the train and ticket offices etc, but is still valid for the majority of the experience). I'd imagine that is what railways will be arguing...
     
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  3. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Most of which I imagine will also be closed, with all tickets being online, so just someone on the gate checking people in. So it's only really corridors on the trains, which will be minimum time.
     
  4. ruddingtonrsh56

    ruddingtonrsh56 Member

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    True. I suppose there may be railways where the only access route for passengers onto the platform is via a ticket office or some enclosed space, but none come to mind. Actually, I tell a lie, I believe (it's been a while since I've been there, but from memory) that is the case at the GCR at Loughborough, which possibly is why last year passengers began and ended their journeys at Quorn where there isn't such restriction.
     
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  5. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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  6. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    The legislation states that you can leave home for work or volunteering purposes (amongst much more). HRA guidance based on this says:
    If the nature of work is ‘reasonably necessary’ then paid staff and volunteers may continue to undertake work.. For heritage rail at this time of year, we would suggest that this might cover anywork required to ensure business continuity so that the business can be fully operational when lockdown ends, which might include:
    • Maintenance of locomotives and other rolling stockto keep them in operational conditionand/or to ensure they are in operational condition for the forthcoming operating season
    • Undertaking heavy overhauls of locomotives and other rolling stock as part of a planned schedule of such work to ensure ongoing provision of locomotives and rolling stock for future years to meet anticipated future business needs
    • Maintenance of infrastructure,track,lineside and buildings to keep them in safe, tidy and operational condition and/or to ensure they are in operational condition for the forthcoming operating season
    • Undertaking infrastructure, track, lineside and building renewals as part of a planned schedule of such work to meet anticipated future business needs
    • Continuance of time sensitive infrastructure or rolling stock projects to meet deadlines, funders requirements and so on
    • Any operating required –e.g. for maintenance, testing, provision of public transport service, or other business reason
    • Monitoring, maintaining and protecting all land and property to keep it secure
    • Normal administration, finance and marketing work required at this time of year
    • Planning, administration, finance, marketing and other office work normally undertaken at this time of year to prepare for the 2021 season."
    Many railways have continued with volunteer input on an invitation only basis. i.e. a volunteer shouldn't just turn up. All the control measures of the railways Covid risk assessment also need to be in place.

    If I were you, Alex, I'd be banging on the door saying 'Why don't you want me? I'm here, ready and willing and you need my skills.' I suspect a lot of current volunteering is being done by those who ask, not those who wait to be asked.
     
  7. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Thanks Steve, I've been in a couple of times for specific jobs, but most of the "essential" C+W activity has been deemed to be fixing various mechanical faults on the running rakes which is less my area. It seems we've decided to mostly ignore point 2 on undertaking heavy overhauls of rolling stock for future years, there's a fair amount in that bracket I could be doing, along with lots more that I'm perfectly willing to accept is very much not in the "reasonably necessary" category (e.g. wagons, signwriting etc.) Just wandering if there had been a view as to where that fitted in with the new staged plan.
     
  8. sleepermonster

    sleepermonster Member

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    I expect each railway will have its own criteria depending on circumstances and resources: do you expect to attract crowds, can you control them if you do?

    The Ecclesbourne precautions at Christmas included:

    Corridor compartment coaches only. Shop closed. Booking office closed; all tickets sold by specific numbered compartments and to be booked online in advance. Buffet closed but pre-ordered refreshments would be placed in your compartment in readiness. Platform toilets supervised to restrict numbers inside and disinfected regularly during each day, passengers advised to use them before travelling. Car park supervised. Coach door handles, grab rails etc disinfected by hygene squad between trains. Passengers organised in socially distanced queues until arriving trains emptied and disinfected, separated outdoor one way routes for passengers arriving and leaving, spacing marks on the platform, train to be fogged daily after the last service. Appropriate PPE for all staff, masks to be worn by passengers except in compartments. Stewards to escort socially distanced passengers to toilets on train if they really could not wait. Steam heat turned up high which encouraged ventilation through open windows. Messroom closed, all volunteers to sign in and out by text or email.

    On that basis the EVR was classified by our local authority as an outdoor attraction, but it takes a lot of volunteers to run a scheme like that.
     
  9. johnofwessex

    johnofwessex Resident of Nat Pres

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    I find it difficult to see why Heritage Railways are classed as 'Outdoord'

    I could imagine that - say Didcot could be classified as 'outdoors' but the idea of spending over an hour on the train to Minehead is 'Outdoors' doesn't really make sense
     
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  10. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Because the only time you're mixing with other people is the part where you're outdoors, assuming use of compartment coaches. I agree with open coaches you get into a bit of a grey area though.
     
  11. Matt78

    Matt78 Well-Known Member

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    tbe train element is considered to be a “transport network” akin to the mainline as opposed to an “indoor” attraction.
     
  12. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    I guess one difference this time round is that most (not all) railways have experience of operating from last year, so essentially operating protocols (everything from ticketing to cleaning door handles) is a known quantity - so it feels like lines can ramp up much quicker. No doubt that explains the flurry of lines planning to open on, or very close to, April 12th.

    Are the ORR likely to put any constraints on? Last year, as I recall, they wanted lines to undergo a period of "shadow" running to prove systems, in advance of opening for the public. I wonder if they are more relaxed this time given the actual shut down period for most lines is probably only a few weeks longer than they would typically have in the new year; and most lines have operational experience of running covid-secure services?

    Tom
     
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  13. Dunfanaghy Road

    Dunfanaghy Road Well-Known Member

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    With open carriages you can fit screens between the bays, so giving some separation (as the Ropley C&W shop has done). Couple that with a 0ne-way flow in and out of the vehicle (enter through the middle door - exit through the end doors) and you are no worse off than a shop at Sainsbury's (or whoever).
    Pat
     
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  14. ruddingtonrsh56

    ruddingtonrsh56 Member

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    The difference is a supermarket is essential shopping, which means it gets a bit more grace for being open in tighter restrictions than a leisure activity that offers similar levels of risk, but is far less essential for basic survival needs...
     
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  15. 21B

    21B Part of the furniture

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    Grace is not required. Properly risk assessed mitigation is. The use of open carriages need not present an unacceptable risk, and did not through last year. We will have to await any change in the guidance to know if the level of risk has changed.

    Comparing the risk in different settings is difficult, but a carriage on the Watercress Line was cleaned internally between services. Had drop light, door handles and other touch points common to more than one group, cleaned at every station. The seating was spaced through the train, and it was kept ventilated. Additional dividers were installed and one way systems and seat allocation enforced. Everyone on board had to wear a face mask unless in a compartment and temperature checks were deployed on entry to the railway (mostly to remind people of the seriousness of the responsibility to not come if not feeling well which was reinforced with messaging and a fair refund policy).


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  16. Springs Branch

    Springs Branch New Member

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    Agree with all you say, but unfortunately many railways are/were still in the hands of local authorities who interpreted the 'rules' differently. East Lancs lost the whole of their Santa operation because of this - despite the cleaning regime as above being very similar, and they are/were the biggest in the country in this regard, carrying 41000 in 2019 and grossing around £900k - take that out of any heritage operation and you know the consequences. However the same local authority allowed, observed and was content with operation of similar Halloween trains 4 weeks earlier.
     
  17. 35B

    35B Nat Pres stalwart

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    If memory serves, the area served by the ELR was moving between tiers at the time, and was in a different status to the MHR. That's not so much a local authority matter (I seem to recall that the ELR had support at the southern end of the line that allowed them to keep going despite restrictions on the part of the line within the Lancashire County Council area.
     
  18. 30854

    30854 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Thinking tangentially folks, do we actually want a legally cut and dried classification? Once you're in an elephant trap, t'ain't gonna be easy to get back out.
     
  19. Springs Branch

    Springs Branch New Member

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    I can advise that it was absolutely a decision that was imposed by the relevant local authority..
     
  20. 35B

    35B Nat Pres stalwart

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    I didn’t say not. But that doesn’t alter the role of the tier system at the time - hence the comparison to the MHR.


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