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S&C Pathfinder Charter - Aug 2018: Now 16/3/19 and with 60163

Discussion in 'What's Going On' started by Big Al, Jul 24, 2018.

  1. DOH46229

    DOH46229 New Member

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    Certainly was Wet,had a good soaking during my postal delivery earlier in the day,then decided to get another soaking to see Tornado
     
  2. lappinp

    lappinp New Member

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    Stormed through Wigan North Western which was lucky for us as we were meant to be on the preceding Glasgow to London train. That arrived over 30 late in the end. My video was rubbish but hopefully someone else got a better shot.
     
  3. Fulwood Flyer

    Fulwood Flyer New Member

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    On a day of persistent strong winds, heavy rain and difficult operating conditions etc., here's a view of 'Tornado' approaching a rather grim Shap summit with the diverted 'Cumbrian Mountaineer'.
    (IMHO)Full credit must go to the locomotive owners, volunteers, operators etc., Network Rail and the railway industry as a whole, for ensuring the continued safe operation of the railways. 60163-Shap Summit ©copyright 2019-PA.jpg
     
  4. 1020 Shireman

    1020 Shireman Part of the furniture Friend

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    Got to drop a 'performance' report in on 60163 Tornado's first 'proper' train since the ill-fated Ebor Flyer last April.

    Cumbrian Mountaineer 16th March 2019

    The storms in the north were always going to be a threat to the Mountaineer and we found out to what extent when we wandered down the platform after lunch, where Allendale Wolf, a superb Ruby Ale, went down far too well. A chat with Richard confirmed what we'd overheard on the platform - that flooding on the S&C at Horton and lower down at Settle and Hellifield had all but closed the line. The only solution was to return to Crewe via Shap and the WCML if they could find us a path. Not what we wanted, but we had 60163 on the front of a heavy 13 coach train so it was going to be noisy for us as we were in the coach behind the Support Coach.

    We were a bit concerned about Grayrigg as on the run north there was a lot of standing water running alongside the tracks around mp22 and some of the rainwater was pouring down the gulleys out onto the tracks. But the rain had eased this side of the fells. There were whistles up front and we rejoined the train quickly as remarkably NR slotted us into a path with the same departure time, 1415 hrs, probably into the LE path our 67 was due to use. Not a real fan of the southbound run over Shap as these days steam doesn't get an uninterrupted run to Shap Summit with a visit to Plumpton UGL below Penrith pretty much a certainty but we had steam back to Crewe so as the great Terry Wogan always said 'Mustn't Grumble'.

    Pete Sheridan was driving; Steve Hanczar was on the shovel with Bob Hart the TI. We were looking forward to 60163 being let loose on a proper train, the first since the Ebor last April. We had load 12 plus the POB. The Generator Car, Kitchen Car, Brake and Buffet Car probably took the weight to some 490 tons. With an almost full complement of passengers, over 500 tons in wet and windy conditions. Long but not that steep sums it up the southbound climb to Shap.

    The level mile level out of the station is followed by 3 1/2 miles of 1in131 starting at mp68. The next 10 miles is, but for a bit of level track, all climbing at gradients of 1in184/228/172. Then there's 3 miles of level track followed by 2 miles of 1in186. Then half a mile of 1in539d and level track leads to almost 2 miles of 1in616. After a short 1in191d, there's a mile of 1in193 then a mile on the level. Then we have to tackle the final 10 miles with the steepest gradients; 6 miles of 1in125 to mp42 followed by a mile and a quarter of 1in142; then after half a mile on the level, almost a mile and a half of 1in106 to the summit. A demanding challenge for a heavy train in any conditions.

    Not too easy a start with a cold fire on a still wet and windy day so we left the station cautiously, leaving the level mile at mp68 at just over 20. Then the unique sound from Tornado increased markedly and echoed around the hills as our speed rose steadily on the 1in131. We passed mp67, a mile into the 1in131 at 29.8, and despite the wet conditions, the big engine forged past mp66 at 34.4; and mp65 at 35.6. Over the last 1/2 mile it got noisier and our speed rose to 39 as the grade changed to almost 2 miles at an easier 1in184. This was becoming a seriously interesting climb and we left the 1in184 at mp62 3/4 at 44.6. When the southbound ascent of Shap was more commonplace, passing through Penrith at 60 was the first target as after the 1in184 the grade eases to 1in228 at mp62 1/4 just below Southwaite. Tornado sounded superb as speed rose to 49.6 at mp61 and to a section max of 50 at mp60. No respite yet as the gradient increases to 1in172 at mp59 1/2, passed at 49.4. We'd already been climbing against the collar for 8 miles but we all know what a great steam raiser the big engine is. We passed mp59 at 48 and lost speed over the next mile to pass Calthwaite, mp58 at 46.2.

    There is some respite then, 2 3/4 miles of level track. One mile in, as we passed mp57 at 48, it became obvious we were not going into Plumpton Loop, and fingers and toes were crossed in the hope the following services were sufficiently late to allow us an uninterrupted climb. We passed the entry to the loop just after mp56 at 55.1 and left the level section at mp55 1/4 at a creditable 57.4. This was turning into something special. Next follows almost 2 miles of 1in186. A mile in and Tornado passed mp54 at 56; and came off it at 53 1/4 at 55.4; some climbing for such a heavy train. Then there's a respite, almost 3/4 of a mile of 1in539down, followed by a half mile of level track. Speed picked up to 61.5 downgrade, then to 64.1 on the level. The noise from upfront increased somewhat as we passed mp52 at the start of almost 2 miles of 1in616 through Penrith at 65. Over the next 1/2 mile speed had increased to 65.8 and we roared through Penrith Station at a superb 66.3; and then to 67.1 at mp51.

    We began to wonder if our luck was really in as Tornado used the short 1in191d to roar past mp50, the start of a mile of 1in193, at 70. Hopes high ..... but then dashed in an instant as the brakes came on quite hard and we drifted into Eden Valley UGL at 15. This is the worse place to be looped as it is half a mile into the start of the 1in125. Only a TP Unit to Manchester Piccadilly passed us so our visit to the loop was only a four minute one. So, 6 miles+ of 1in125 awaited us as we were signalled out of the loop. The fire must have been in good shape as within a mile, 60163 was charging up the 1in125 at 31.6. Better was to come as a mile further on we passed mp45 at 40.8; then mp44 at 42. The climb began to take its toll and we'd dropped back to 40 at mp42 3/4, before Tornado suffered a rare slip. Speed fell back to 37 and we'd lost our momentum somewhat.

    Up front they recovered the slip and the big engine dug in to pass mp42 at 37. Then there was a steady fall off to 34.7 as we left the 1in125 at mp41 1/4. The final 3 miles to the summit beckoned. First comes 1 1/4 miles of 1in142 that we left at 35. On the next half mile+ on the level Tornado recovered to take 40.1 onto the final mile and a half of 1in106 to the climbing summit at near enough mp38. Our speed fell slowly to 32 at the milepost and rose to 39.7 at the Shap Summit Board on the plateau at mp37 1/2. Such a shame we didn't get an uninterrupted climb to the summit. You really wouldn't have known it was wet and windy and 60163 had over 500 tons behind it.

    No more serious climbing and we were booked into Carnforth Up Passenger Loop to let service trains pass. Heavy braking down Shap - passed Scout Green at 50; Tebay at 51 and coasted to Grayrigg in the high 40s. The brakes came off and speed rose to 65 ; charged through Oxenholme Station at 73 and hit 75 by mp18 1/4, a speed we more or less held down Grayrigg, passing Milnethorpe, mp13 1/2 at 74.1. The brakes came in at mp8 1/2, a couple of miles from the loop. We duly pulled in and saw Les Ross waiting in the U&DGL for the returning Cumbrian Coast Express. The first service following us joined it - our diesel, 67005. Only a couple of trains passed us before we were let out to continue on through Lancaster and on to Preston for a water stop.

    Think only one train passed us as we sat in the loop. When we were let out there was plenty of noise from up front as the crew used the mile and a half+ at 1in460d to get us to 40. On the mile on the level, speed and noise rose and we passed Hest Bank at 47. There's a gentle bank, 1 3/4 miles of 1in469, that we left at 55; and then 3/4 mile of 1in305 where speed rose slightly to 56. On the level approach to Lancaster Castle there was quite a snarl from up front and we blasted through the middle road at 60, dropping back to 51.4 at the top of the 3/4 mile of 1in98. Speed picked up down the 1in739 past Oubeck Loops, 62, and we left the section at 65. Now there's almost 4 miles of level track and Tornado sounded superb as speed picked up to pass Bay Horse at 66. We left the section at 67 and picked up a bit down the 1in1199 to pass Scorton at 68. Pretty much level or just a little downgrade for the next four miles to pass Garstang at 70.

    The gentle 2 1/2 miles of 1in644 saw a slight drop to 67 and just before Barton Loop on the 1in1115 the brakes came on as we drifted towards Preston. We were held for 4 minutes outside the station before running into Platform 7. We were told Control were holding us until 1745 to link into our original path through Farington Junction. The front 7 coaches weren't platformed and it took us a while to get off the train to go celebrate Wales' Grand Slam. The First Class and Dining Passengers seemed to think they owned the carriages and didn't like us walking through!!

    It was still raining, but not heavily. It's only a hundred yards or so to the Old Vic. Busy pub but lots of bar staff. A very nice pint of Saltaire Amarillo did the job nicely; but we didn't hang around for a second in case Control changed its mind. It didn't and we left at 1745. There's a mile of downgrade out of the station, followed by 6 miles of mixed gradients, 1in440/106/314/110/432 to provide some noise. We took 26 off the downgrade and then there was a distinct tug from the front as Pete attacked the climb away. After a mile of 1in440, we passed Farington Jn at 39. Over the 3/4 mile of 1in106 speed rose noisily to 43. On the 1in314 we got to 48 before braking for Leyland, passed at 35. Nothing around so don't know why we braked. Up the 1/2 mile of 1in110 speed fell to 31 before a noisy charge up the 3/4 mile of 1in432 saw us cross Euxton Jn at 41.

    Downgrade to Balshaw Lane, 45 and then a noisy mile+ of 1in114/115 to hold 44. Bit of mixed 1in106/296/157/600ish where speed rose to 50 before we hit the long run downgrade most of the way to Warrington. Speed rose rapidly to 70 at mp8 1/2. A touch of the brakes saw us hare through Wigan North Western at 69, rising to 73 before braking for Golborne Jn, 50. Back up to 72 across Winwick Jn and running at 71 until firm braking for Warrington Bank Quay, 50. Pity that as there's a mile and a quarter of 1in135 to tackle and consequently speed fell to 39 across Acton Bridge Jn. Down the mile of 1in135d we picked up rapidly to 60, then to 62 on the level. Up the mile and a half if 1in567 the noise from up front was impressive as speed was held at 63/2 before a short 1/4 at 1in112 dropped us back to 60. 60163 was opened up on the mile+ of 1in180, to hold speed around 60. Down to Weaver Jn, 67, up a mile and a half of 1in330 to Acton Bridge, 66; 67 after 3/4 mile on the level; down to 65 after a mile of 1in440. Nice noisy running.

    Through Hartford at 65; down the 1in360d to 70; down to 58 after 2 miles of 1in419. The track levels off through Winsford, 57, before a mile+ of 1in300, left at 60. 60163 was eased then and we drifted down towards Crewe. We were held for a minute or so at the final signal gantry as we had to cross over all the running lines to get to Platform 12. We got in some 20 minutes early after an excellent run down the WCML.

    Not the route we were expecting and not one of my favourites. But it showed that 60163 is well and truly back. A sparkling performance from Carlisle to mp50, north of Penrith, and a more than decent climb up the 1in125 and 1in106 to Shap summit from a standing start in Eden Valley UGL. And to finish what had been a good day despite the weather, Preston to just north of Crewe's Signal Stop in 57 1/2 minutes was decent enough with a 13 coach train.

    Thanks to Pathfinder for running the train and to their onboard helpers who were a happy group all day; to the A1SLT and the support group for providing 60163 in such excellent condition; to DB for facilitating the train; their crews really know how to get the best out of 60163; and to Network Rail for finding a 'right time' path for us down the WCML when the S&C was closed. We'd have been in real trouble if they'd let us down past Peterril Jn and out onto the S&C line. Shame about the Eden Valley UGL looping, but we had no chance of outrunning the TP Unit to Shap.

    So good to have the magnificent engine back on the mainline where it belongs. Think this run shows 60163 is in fine fettle to take on the rest of its mainline programme. It looked and sounded superb. Looking forward to our next run as it is 60163's Border Raider, the 'anti-clockwise' Crewe-Carlisle-Crewe circle, where we should get a crack at the S&C northbound and another run at Shap on the return. But who knows...
     
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2019
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  5. Where's Mazeppa?

    Where's Mazeppa? Member

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    Ah, a nice name-check for the late, great Terry Wigan. Absolutely Pier-less!!

    Seriously though, many thanks for an absorbing account of an un-predicted day's running.
     
  6. 1020 Shireman

    1020 Shireman Part of the furniture Friend

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    Thanks for pointing out the typo. Now corrected.
     
  7. lappinp

    lappinp New Member

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    Great report and nice to know I caught it doing 69 through Wigan Terry Western. :)
     
  8. Oswald T Wistle

    Oswald T Wistle Well-Known Member Friend

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    Received a letter from Pathfinder "clarifying" the reason for the change of route on Saturday. Scan.jpg
     
  9. 46203

    46203 Member

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    Cannot be towed backwards?
     
  10. sgthompson

    sgthompson Part of the furniture Friend

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    Seems odd that as a few years back I was on the Southbound Citadel over Shap with 46233 and we were looped at Shap summit but the points in front wouldn’t open so the whole train had to reverse out onto the mainline. Not towed I agree but still went backwards.Many a tour from 10A also drags the train to say Preston or Manchester with steam on the rear an all .
     
  11. iancawthorne

    iancawthorne Well-Known Member

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    There have been plenty of top and tail examples with WCRC where the tail loco would be "towed backwards". The two RTC jobs to Whitby last year being one example. Is that statement limited to DBC safety case I wonder?
     
  12. Oswald T Wistle

    Oswald T Wistle Well-Known Member Friend

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    Last year’s Whitby Flyer on its return journey involved a rather energetic bit of running between Thirsk and York. A backward travelling, ie tender first, 8F on the rear was hanging on for grim death as the forward facing B1 on the front made a bolt for home.
     
  13. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

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    I don't know but you could be correct re DBC and what they allow. What I do know is, for example, that any instance when a diesel attached at the rear may assist in any shape or form is cleared beforehand and is not at the whim of the crew on the day, or whoever is on the diesel.
     
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  14. guycarr360

    guycarr360 Part of the furniture

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    For arguments sake, if they tried to get down the S&C, and got to say, Ribblehead, only to be turned back, would everybody have been happy, adding 2-3 hours onto their journey. Sensible option taken in my opinion.
     
  15. Oswald T Wistle

    Oswald T Wistle Well-Known Member Friend

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    Absolutely the correct decision by NR (who sorted a very acceptable path back to Crewe). It is not the decision that seems odd but Pathfinder's reason; they could simply have said that the S&C was closed because of flooding - which it was!
     
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  16. 1020 Shireman

    1020 Shireman Part of the furniture Friend

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    Weirdest reason I've seen in writing. Apparently they were paddling in London Road Yard and it wasn't raining that heavily in the Carlisle area. The really heavy stuff had moved south east onto the S&C side of the fells. The railcams showed that. Wasn't a cat in hell's chance of going back via the S&C. NR made the only decision they could and we were amazed a path was there for us - think we pinched the LE path in part.
     
  17. MarkinDurham

    MarkinDurham Well-Known Member

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    I was passing Whalley viaduct at about the time that 60163 was due, heading to York from Blackpool via the A59. We pulled up in the layby opposite the viaduct so that I could check RTT - as it hadn't updated from the Carlisle departure I quickly realised that there was something amiss, so we simply set off again. We did notice a few cars parked in the layby on the westbound side - we did wonder if there were folk hoping to see the train waiting in them...

    I have never seen standing water quite like Saturday's conditions as we approached the Skipton area. It made for challenging driving conditions...
     
  18. MellishR

    MellishR Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    Only just noticed
    What is your definition of 'proper' that excludes the Auld Reekie and the Aberdonian?
     
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  19. 1020 Shireman

    1020 Shireman Part of the furniture Friend

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    One with some decent bank climbing and worthwhile load for the big engine.
     
  20. torgormaig

    torgormaig Part of the furniture Friend

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    None of that on the Aberdeen road of course..............!

    Peter
     
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