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Edmonson tickets a lost "cause" for ever?

Discussion in 'Heritage Railways & Centres in the UK' started by steamdream, May 5, 2011.

  1. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Some lines like the SVR don't require you to show your pass at the ticket office and exchange for a ticket, the pass shown to the TTI is sufficient. I did nearly get a hole punched in my work permit by a new TTI on the SVR once though!
     
  2. BrightonBaltic

    BrightonBaltic Member

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    I remember reading that the Dartmouth Steam Railway & Riverboat Company regard modern ticketing as essential to their business, particularly when it comes to monitoring who's on the trains and who's on the boats!
     
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  3. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    I get free first class travel on the Bluebell (as a life member). For many years you just showed a pass; about two years ago the booking offices started issuing tickets. These are Edmondson, and still free, but allow numbers of people travelling for free to be counted (and, at which station they started).

    I don’t know how we measure on-train loadings, since with non-corridor stock in regular use, we don’t routinely use TTIs who can make a count en-route. We also have separate 1st and 3rd class tickets, so overcrowding could be an issue for one independent of the other. I believe that guards have the authority to allow 3rd class passengers to use 1st class compartments if 3rd is crowded but there are vacant seats in 1st.

    In any case, people break their journeys at intermediate stations. I suspect things are done mostly just on ticket sales.

    Tom
     
  4. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Quite, as far as I know the passenger counts we do are solely for the commercial department to decide what trains are worth running, hence I've been known to write "too busy to walk down the train!" and that was sufficient information for the purposes it was intended! The yearly figures come from the tickets sold.
     
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  5. Wenlock

    Wenlock Well-Known Member Friend

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    Not requiring a travel ticket to be obtained misses an opportunity to monitor usage. If I were to attempt to travel at the SVR I would not be sure whether I'm entitled to free travel on my grade card unless or until I had asked at the ticket office anyway. On the MHR example in my previous post, the clerk wrote KESR in the box printed on the card ticket, I expect he may have written the same on his sheet against that ticket's number.
     
  6. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    I agree it seems odd, I always go to the ticket office with my pass anyway as a courtesy to check, every time it's the same, usually after a confused BOC has had a conversation in the backroom they simply tell me to show it on the train. It's the only railway I know that does it of the ones I've used my pass on.
     
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  7. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    I went back to 2011 and read it, no reference to "big chuffers" thankfully and |I'm happy to leave that there, but I burst out laughing when I read "a future generation which asks accusingly "why did you not buy new boilers and new rail"..." As a member of the future generation, it's a risk I'm willing to take!! Once again I'm slightly puzzled by your views; on the one hand you deride some railways for ignoring heritage and merely offering a theme park steam train ride, but on the other you say things like "Things that lines don't absolutely have to have,... may have to go". Is spending a bit of money maintaining the heritage atmosphere beyond having a steam engine at the front of a train good or bad in Paulhitchland?
     
  8. gwalkeriow

    gwalkeriow Well-Known Member

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    It should be remembered that the EPOS systems in place can be used in more that just the ticket offices, at Havenstreet they are also used in the shop and café. I assume that it is all part of the same system.
     
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  9. Bean-counter

    Bean-counter Part of the furniture

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    In many ways, total passenger numbers are almost an 'ego' thing, although they do give an indication (like £ revenue) of overall size of the business. For a railway with intermediate stations, passenger counts are what are needed to judge timetable and train length requirements, although the 'average ticket yield per head' must not be forgotten - if this is say £12, deciding whether a train with 50 passengers on is worth running might be different from it it is £6 per head! I would suggest that too much detailed information could make clear decision making harder!

    Steven
     
  10. Greenway

    Greenway Part of the furniture

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    This is correct. It is essential to know how many tickets have been sold that include journeys by any of the companies vessels.
    You can get away with standing passengers most of the time on the railway (not sure how that might pan out in an accident!) but passenger vessels, including the ferries, have a certificate stating the maximum number of passengers that can be on board.
    A large percentage of booking are now apparently done online - the tickets are collected on arrival. All tickets are checked - and punched - ;) by the travelling TTI's.
    Everyone, even those with the varied types of pass, is required to have a ticket.
     
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2018
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  11. paulhitch

    paulhitch Guest

    It's quite simple really. It's a matter of how resources are expended because they are not infinite. For instance I would rather see an 1864 carriage splendidly restored than ten years of Edmondson tickets. Others may disagree. Too many "big chuffers" and there will be neither.

    PH
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 18, 2018
  12. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Do you at least accept that that is only your personal opinion and other people may prioritise different aspects of heritage differently?
     
  13. Bean-counter

    Bean-counter Part of the furniture

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    Probably are, but the data outputs will be very different and use of EPOS to monitor retail stock levels can be very useful, but probably just reveals that many lines of stick move very slowly and there aren't enough fast moving ones to fill the shelves!

    Remember, many of these systems are designed for use in multi-site, national or internal businesses where vast sums of data need to be capable of being consolidated and analysed quickly, and obtaining shop-floor feedback is harder. I would suggest that to view even the busiest UK railways like that is a very dangerous mistake. You know what you buy regularly, it doesn't take long to look at what is on the shelves and it isn't hard to filter any individual bias when talking to staff about what sells and what doesn't. Decision making and operations should be much closer together than in the likes of Tesco or M & S!

    In tea rooms, EPOS can be a menace - deciding it won't let you sell any more bacon butties in a busy patch because there hasn't been time to tell it another pack of bacon has been brought from the freeze!

    Even if they are used in shops, extra terminals for 'railway wide' use are far from cheap - there needs to be a good reason to use them other than 'let's use the same system'.

    Steven
     
  14. Bean-counter

    Bean-counter Part of the furniture

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    Paul, please can you explain how Edmonson tickets use more resources than buying expensive EPOS terminal and associated equipment and paying annual support fees for the software (let's ignore any external training costs etc. for the moment)?

    Please can you also explain how, especially on a line with largely one station for originating traffic, EPOS data helps run the business to the extent of offsetting these costs and Edmonson wouldn't?

    Many thanks

    Steven
     
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  15. Kje7812

    Kje7812 Part of the furniture

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    Nope, on the SVR it's just show the pass on the train.
    Shareholders (depending on exact holding as higher one get passes) used to get vouchers which had to be exchanged for tickets. But this has now moved to them being given tickets which are just dated and gripped.
    If that's your only form of ID, it's fine. I would accept it.
    SVR staff are issued with separate yearly staff passes in addition to their grade cards. Only the staff pass is valid for train travel.
     
  16. Bean-counter

    Bean-counter Part of the furniture

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    Quite - I suspect many passengers will appreciate 'an old fashioned ticket' while not realising that the loco on their train would never have run in this line in the past (but then again, passengers tend to like big, named locos, so I suppose there must be a view that authenticity should over-ride what fare-paying passengers want......!)

    Steven
     
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  17. paulhitch

    paulhitch Guest

    Of course. I am just concerned that they do think about cost implications.

    PH
     
  18. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    I don't know how you sleep at night worrying about every heritage railways' financial situations on their behalf...
     
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  19. paulhitch

    paulhitch Guest

    You appear to have a similar approach to EPOS as I do to "big chufferitis!
    Here we have to differ, for I am convinced that, at least in part it is enthusiasts who want "old fashioned" tickets and "big named locos" rather than "passengers". I make a point of talking to visitors.

    Paul H
     
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  20. paulhitch

    paulhitch Guest

    TuT tut.
     

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