SVR General Discussion

Yes, I can't see it working either which makes you wonder what the point of the trial is, unless it's simply to prove the point that such a service isn't viable?.

 

Well at the time when it was still a franchise it was a requirement of the award. Not sure the creation of GBR would just over ride that.

 

The point is it’s a requirement of the franchise, and those requirements have carried over to GBR. WMRE have long since promised a trial. So it happens.

I’m yet to work out why people are so negative or “non-positive” about such a good thing for all parties!

 

No, it’s not. But what happens when a connection is missed does matter.

 

Couldn't agree more, the amount of 'free' publicity this has generated for the SVR is worth it alone.
I too remain to be convinced that this is financially viable long term, but it is at no financial cost to the SVR atm, will prove or disprove a concept and brings together more industry partners. As recent events have shown, having lots of friends in the rail industry proves very useful in a crisis and can definitely save money then.

There is much being written about this being a Bewdley to Birmingham service, however, one YouTube video I found, saw passengers using it as a connection to Worcester too. Perhaps this should be pushed more too!

 

I do not think it is negativity that is being shown, at least as far as the SVR concerned. It is more a sense of realism of how many obstacles would be involved to make this work long term, many of which you mentioned yourself. And of course the apparent inability of the national network to think outside the box, which I suspect the now full government ownership will make worse.

 

Which is exactly why a trial like this is important - to demonstrate how it can work.
One of the biggest obstacles to things happening is people saying 'oh no, that would be too difficult '. This trial is the opposite, it is showing that with a bit of working together a useful service could be provided.
Another way of looking at those passenger figures is that 17 people on a bus isn't a bad load. Given nearly every bus service is heavily subsidised and some run around empty, then maybe being financially viable isn't the end goal here, but opening up new journey options for people.
Either way, in 8 weeks someone will crunch the numbers and come up with a decision based on cost and benefit - the SVR will definitely have benefited.

 

There is no question that the trial has been a good thing and that it shows positive relationships.

My scepticism about the long term merits of this as a service is based on three points:
1. The absolute numbers using the trial - as you say, 17 is a reasonable single decker bus load.
2. The financial costs of providing the service in the longer term, including to the SVR as it exposes itself to government procurement behaviour
3. The compromises inherent in running a national network service on a heritage railway

 

But the trail will only show limited data.
I think we all agree it is not a viable option to have the SVR operate the service with volunteers long term. WMT or GBR operating a service will come with all those issues that @2857Harry mentioned, especially those concerning ASLEF and the RMT. To meet those alone I would suggest would cost way more than the DfT would see as a good ROI. Plus as you have said yourself why would one government department subsidise a bus route and then the DfT subsidise a competing rail service. Yes I know it happens in various places already, really by unfortunate default, like Wareham to Poole for example, but like here it is normally where the rail service is part of a longer route, in this example Weymouth to Waterloo. Not something that needs loads spent to achieve it.

 

Buses are heavily subsidised but the cost is nowhere near the subsidy provided to any single rail service in the country. Harry has indicated the trial is a franchise commitment so I completely understand why it is happening, however I fully expect the numbers to be crunched and the WMRE (made up of LA's, some with no direct interest in Bewdley or Birmingham) to decide they won't be pursuing it long term. Short term it's a nice feather in the cap of everyone but I think that's as far as it will go.

 

Anyway, latest issue of Branchlines
https://www.svrlive.com/blsep26

 

Whilst the current trial uses SVR stock at services terminating at the SVR station no-one seems have considered the future prospect of using WMT trains and working through services with a Kidderminster terminator using the main line connection rather than simply turning back. One or 2 trains in each peak hour could possibly be worked up to Bridgnorth and / or a Saturday shoppers' service could operate to Birmingham. Once the trial confirms both feasibility and support the main line connection could host a lot of opportunities especially in a region which has road problems in the centre of Birmingham.

 

It's been mentioned many times in this thread and the reasons why it won't work.

 

Well to be fair some people have identified potential difficulties. Any arrangement can be made to work if there is the will to succeed, find solutions and invest sufficient resources! Nothing would ever be achieved if the glass-half-full merchants always held sway. Run the trial, see what works and doesn't work, learn from it and be imaginative in the search for future operating, technical or marketing opportunities between the stakeholders.

 

You can make almost anything happen if you apply infinite resources to it. In the real world, infinite resources don't exist so people have to work within what is there. As for mainline running on heritage railways those compromises are known and understood - the interesting question for Bewdley is how they balance out for a 3 mile service extension. I will be very surprised (in a pleasant way) if they do balance out in favour of making it happen in the long term.

 

I can see many many problems with the idea. But, if you don't try, you never find out.

I doubt anyone is going to yes/no this on the basis of the 17 people whose travel plans and flexibility allowed them to take it up. But it will show up issues, make concrete a lot of vague hand-waving suppositions on each side.
I would imagine if it goes forward, it will be for a longer trial.

 

As Milo Medin famously observed, "With enough thrust, anything can fly!" (I'm not sure if he originated that phrase; the early Internet technical community all picked it up from him, though.)

Noel

 

Railway Herald has 46115 going from Carnforth to Kidderminster tomorrow, RTT shows a departure around 11.30. Can't see any other comment on this, what's it about?

 

For the Autumn Steam Gala.

 

Thanks, obviously missed that, in my mind it was out of certificate, obviously not.