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Tender Austerity at Ribble Steam Railway

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by daveannjon, Aug 13, 2017.

  1. Fireline

    Fireline Active Member

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    With Tenterden bank, we need the water in the tanks over the driving wheels. Simples.
     
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  2. 61624

    61624 Part of the furniture

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    An interesting possible prototype for lines like the Ecclesbourne Valley or Wensleydale, perhaps, if they have aspirations to go more BR-like but can't attract ex-BR locos?
     
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  3. martin1656

    martin1656 Part of the furniture

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    So how does the Norwegian cope on the bank, and how did Foxcote Manor handle the bank, personally i would rather see the water in the top nut myself , so i'm not in danger of having to low a water level when the regulator is closed .
     
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  4. Wenlock

    Wenlock Active Member Friend

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    I have been on a Norwegian hauled train which slipped to a stand on the bank, expected to need to protect train for assistance, but driver managed to get it moving again. The Manor is of course heavier even without a saddletank.
     
  5. Fireline

    Fireline Active Member

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    The Norwegian, as Wenlock says, is at it's limits on the bank. Foxcote has more tractive effort, so can cope. It's nothing to do with the water level in the boiler, but having sufficient weight over the driving wheels to give traction. Seagull has already confirmed this at least once.
     
  6. Miff

    Miff Well-Known Member Friend

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    K&ESR have fitted Austerities and USA tanks with their own design (not based on Porta) of multijet exhaust.
     
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  7. daveannjon

    daveannjon Active Member

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    Congratulations to Ribble for doing this just four weeks after my original post, they seem to have excellent engineering resources.

    Dave
     
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  8. chrishallam

    chrishallam Active Member

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    Out of interest, what sort of weight are the trains she hauls? We had King Haakon, her sister loco at the NVR a few years ago and from memory she was limited to 3 Danish coaches on our relatively flat line... I guess about 120-140t, but don't have the weights to hand
     
  9. Miff

    Miff Well-Known Member Friend

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    The first time I went to the K&ESR was on a rainy day in 1975 and I remember the Norwegian slipping on wet rails even as it ran round the train. On the day Wittersham Road station reopened in 1977 it had to haul a packed 5-coach train up Tenterden bank after an assisting loco (Sutton) at the other end of the train failed and was taken off. It did so in fine style but that was a dry day. Nowadays I believe it is normally limited to 4 Mk1s.
     
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  10. andrewshimmin

    andrewshimmin Active Member

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    Sorry for continuing the thread drift, but...
    If they can't do gradients, how did these locos cope in Norway?!?! I don't think there's a level piece of track in the whole country... Then again I suppose there isn't a high population either so maybe a couple of coaches was more than enough?
     
  11. The Saggin' Dragon

    The Saggin' Dragon Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator Friend

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    Slipperyness can have much to do with tyre profiles, rail conditions, driving techniques, as well as gradient.
     
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  12. BrightonBaltic

    BrightonBaltic Member Account Suspended

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    Regarding the slightly odd short wheelbase on the Austerity conversion - you could always stick a leading truck under the front, paint it red and make it more 'James' than 'Douglas' in appearance...
     
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  13. Fireline

    Fireline Active Member

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    We base our loco assessment on how many coaches they can pull up Tenterden Bank. The Norwegian is limited to 4, and she's got nothing left at that. The Austerity tanks, Yank tanks and Pannier manage 5. In wet rail conditions, I have been told that the Norwegian is "interesting"....
     
  14. Wenlock

    Wenlock Active Member Friend

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    On the occasion I referred to earlier, it was a drizzly day. Which is of course worse than continuous heavy rain, greasier.

    I believe the sanders failed due to a compressor fault. Unable to fix compressor (externally mounted well ahead of cab). Once at a stand, it was possible to re-start compressor and set-back slightly to lay sand for another attempt at the bank which was successful. The Norwegian can normally cope with 140 tons.
     
  15. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Resident of Nat Pres

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    Out of interest, what is the TE of the Norwegian? What's the axle loading?

    Tom
     
  16. GWR Man.

    GWR Man. Well-Known Member

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    TE is 18,058 and the total weight is 61 1/2 tons. So axle loading most likely about 10 tons
     
  17. Wenlock

    Wenlock Active Member Friend

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    Interesting, that looks like the figures for King Haakon as quoted in BRC stock book, whereas the KESR stock book lists No 376 as loco 38 tons, tender 22 tons, TE 18560
     
  18. BrightonBaltic

    BrightonBaltic Member Account Suspended

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    I've run the figures for bore, stroke, PSI and wheel diameter off the KESR website through the SMEX calculator (which generally rounds to the nearest hundred lb) and got 18,600lb. According to steamlocomotive.com, "The 21c had feedwater heaters and weighed 38.3 metric tons (84,437 lb) overall with 29,700 kg (65,477 lb) on the drivers". This would give an axle loading of a wee bit under 9 3/4 tons.
     
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  19. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Resident of Nat Pres

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    If those figures are right, it's got an incredibly low factor of adhesion - no wonder it can be "interesting" uphill!

    (I make it 65477/18600 = 3.52. In comparison, a Schools - notably slippery - is 3.74; most locos are over 4).

    Tom
     
  20. andrewshimmin

    andrewshimmin Active Member

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    Hence my question - how did they manage in Norway?!?!?
     

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