Is there such a thing as too many heritage railways?

They are ghastly!

 

I don't actually think a Mk.1 has anything, except sentimentality, to commend itself over a modern mainline vehicle. However the Bluebell's Maunsell droplight third commended earlier, should cause any TOC furiously to think. The best four wheelers have an obvious antiquity and style which is unbeatable. This can include upholstered ceilings in the manner of contemporary private road carriages.

I suppose one can get sentimental about formica.

PH

 

Disagree with you on one point Mr Hitch - I can see out of the windows in a Mark One.

 

The main thing about a mk1 is that it is in period for a lot of the motive power hauling it, in a modern vehicle you may as well be on the national network. A heritage railway is a working museum and it's a travel experience from a bygone age or at least that's what it should be.

 

Most of the public I experience are more than happy with the "feel" of a well presented Mark 1. Shabbiness seems to be a far greater sin.

Sent from my HTC Desire 620 using Tapatalk

 

Got to disagree there PH - no comparison between the space per passenger in a Mk1 & any of the modern stuff (except perhaps 1st class). Also many Mk1s are compartment stock, a further comfort advantage, and as has been mentioned they have the basic requirement of windows aligned with seating.

 

Firstly dirt is the thing which offends the most. Secondly shabbiness, which is aggravated by lack of covered accommodation or, failing this, fitted tarpaulins for winter storage. A shabby exterior can be mistaken for a dirty one.

PH

 

I actually agree with PH's main point (I normally do) which is to say that I always travel in the oldest carriage in the train (may require a bit of deception of my dear wife in the matter of train heating in different eras...) and wouldn't shed a tear if many of the very nasty Mk1s about the place got cut up and their useable parts donated to replica pre-grouping vehicles.
However, I have to say that, for those of us mostly growing up in the Sprinter and Pacer era, we can certainly have nostalgia for Mk1 compartment stock, at least. For me it always reminds me of summer outings to Colwyn Bay... Happy days!
That said, I have had unpleasant experiences with Mk1s on preserved railways, including clouds of dust emerging from seats when you sit down, unpleasant damp smells remarkably reminiscent of a cat gone off somewhere to die, and suspicious stains spreading across the floor. And no, it wasn't a murder mystery train.
People are paying for a train ride. They deserve a clean dry seat which isn't ripped, a floor which isn't sticky, and windows they can see out of. And not to be dripped on.
When that's sorted, think about the exterior cleanliness and paintwork.
Then you can worry about what loco is on the front, and what livery it's in...
(It's probably an express passenger loco running tender first at 15 miles an hour and looking a bit ashamed of itself...)

 

I wouldn't disagree with that, but I feel some folk unfairly dislike mk1s when in fact they just dislike tatty carriages, which just tend to be mk1s for a variety of reasons not necessarily to do with their design.

 

Oh so exactly my sentiments. Would only add that I know some pre-Grouping carriages that have the cosiest steam heated winter interiors imaginable. Upholstery clean and in good order. Adverts for Bluthner pianos ("the Stradivarius of the pianoforte") or the Charing Cross Hotel alongside the mirror. Why are such simple delights so relatively uncommon?

Paul H

 

i noticed the same when we outshoped Pedros, it had an all new interiour, with much varnished wood , a mk 1 properly done can be as attractive as an 1930's Maunsel coach, people filled it up before any other coach, i agree interiours let down many railways, but coaches are to some the poor relation, they think nothing of spending £10'00's on an engine, but bulk at paying out for a proper job to be done on coach, so its a patch up job, some railways are now beginning to realise that a proper carrage depot has to be a must, and covered accomodation , I agree, the SECR , 4 wheelers are very nice, but not all 4 wheelers were like this, the district coach is very spartan indeed.

 

S0rry but who or what is Pedros please?

Paul H

 

Interestingly, I took my 86 year old Father to one of the HST prototype operating days on the GCR(N) easlier this year. He actually commented, on hearing the PA announcements made during the run, that it was "just like being on a real train" !!
Not the sort of thing I would have expected from someone of his age group who would have travelled on ex GER coaching stock in his earlier years......

 

Presumably "Petros". (Disabled accessible Mk I brake on KESR)

 

I take an interest in heritage coaching stock (a big lottery win woud see me splashing out to help coach projects first ) and will try and ride something that is not a mk1 where I can...but...a well presented mk1 can provide a pleasant comfortable ride with big windows to look out of and opening toplights to let in the sound and smell (steam only) of the loco.

 

Back in the 1970s I remember members of the public being very disappointed with the KWVR's MkIs. They thought they were no different from British Rail trains.

In the 1990s, when the class 308s were transferred to work the newly electrified Airedale/Wharfedale routes, the KWVR was running some MkIs that were younger than the adjacent main line stock.

As an aside, I've always thought that MkIs look wrong for branch lines like the KWVR, which were the domain of non-corridor stock.

 

Agreed, but unfortunately non corridor stock is inconvenient for a number of reasons!

 

Alex, dont you mean incontinent ? that got to be a very pressing reason for onboard toilets

 

M.H.R., Bluebell and I.O.W.S.R. (there may well be others) all have vehicles converted for wheelchair use which are most definitely not Mk. 1s.

PH

 

As the late Mandy Rice-Davis put it so well "He would say that wouldn't he"

PH