If you register, you can do a lot more. And become an active part of our growing community. You'll have access to hidden forums, and enjoy the ability of replying and starting conversations.

Harz Narrow Gauge - HSB

Discussion in 'International Heritage Railways/Tramways' started by Fred Kerr, Feb 12, 2017.

  1. pmh_74

    pmh_74 Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2009
    Messages:
    1,064
    Likes Received:
    285
    That's quite mild. Last time I went up the Fichtelbergbahn (Cranzahl-Oberwiesenthal) it was -20°C at the top! (December 2009).
     
  2. Fred Kerr

    Fred Kerr Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2006
    Messages:
    5,059
    Likes Received:
    1,764
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Freelance photo - journalist
    Location:
    Southport
  3. OldGit

    OldGit New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2012
    Messages:
    132
    Likes Received:
    62
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Sutton, Surrey
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Just returned from a super tour of the Harz network.
    Can anyone explain the numbering system(s) on the HSB steam loco's please
    Thanks in advance.
     
  4. Spamcan81

    Spamcan81 Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2007
    Messages:
    25,192
    Likes Received:
    8,059
    Occupation:
    Training moles
    Location:
    The back of beyond
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    99 refers to anything narrow gauge. The 59xx series are the Mallets, the 72xx series the heavy 2-10-2T, the 60xx series the one off 2-6-2T and the 61xx the two 0-6-0Ts. One of the 2-10-2Ts carries it's pre DDR number - 99 222. When DDR started computerising, a computer check digit was added to running numbers, e.g. 99 7241-5.
     
    OldGit likes this.
  5. Fred Kerr

    Fred Kerr Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2006
    Messages:
    5,059
    Likes Received:
    1,764
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Freelance photo - journalist
    Location:
    Southport
    In addition note that the first digit of the 4-character serial number denotes the gauge on which the locomotive works. In the mid-1970s it was also used to identify oil-fired locomotives hence the current Class 99.23 (99.231-247 now 99.7231-7247) bearing the fleet numbers 99.0231-0247.

    The class numbers were those used by the pre-WWII Deutsches Reichsbahn and continued by the post-WWII Deutsches Demoktratische Rechsbahn (DDR); these are taken from the fleet number hence 99.222 / 7222 is part of Class 99.22 which originally included 99.221-223 whilst Class 99.23 includes 99.231-247 (now 7231-7247). For anyone who is interested, information on the Harz / HSB network is contained in a personal book (which I am seeking to get published) that can be seen at :

    https://www.albelli.co.uk/view-online-photo-book/929a379b-fe86-491f-8357-9848257e9963
     
    OldGit likes this.
  6. Spamcan81

    Spamcan81 Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2007
    Messages:
    25,192
    Likes Received:
    8,059
    Occupation:
    Training moles
    Location:
    The back of beyond
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    So how doses that work with the 99.59 Mallets, the 99.60 2-6-2T and the 99.61 0-6-0Ts?
     
    OldGit likes this.
  7. Fred Kerr

    Fred Kerr Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2006
    Messages:
    5,059
    Likes Received:
    1,764
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Freelance photo - journalist
    Location:
    Southport
    You'll need to ask the Germans that one BUT in my 1977 copy of Taschenbuch Deutsche Schmalspur-Dampflokomotiven these 3 classes are catalogued as 99.590, 99.600 and 99.610 respectively; these are the classifications that are still used today as far as more up to date books classify them. I can only think that the classification of the Saxon Meyers (Class 99.51-60 = 99.511-608 / 99.1511-1608) and the Saxon VK (Class 61 = 99.611-619) got there first but then I'm no expert on German traction or logic !
     
    OldGit likes this.
  8. OldGit

    OldGit New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2012
    Messages:
    132
    Likes Received:
    62
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Sutton, Surrey
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Thanks very much Gents.

    I am now much enlightened.
     
  9. OldGit

    OldGit New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2012
    Messages:
    132
    Likes Received:
    62
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Sutton, Surrey
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Fred,

    Love the photo-book. Good luck with getting it published - It certainly deserves a wider audience.
     
  10. Spamcan81

    Spamcan81 Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2007
    Messages:
    25,192
    Likes Received:
    8,059
    Occupation:
    Training moles
    Location:
    The back of beyond
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    As you suggest, perhaps the system post dates all but the 99.72 class.
     
  11. Fred Kerr

    Fred Kerr Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2006
    Messages:
    5,059
    Likes Received:
    1,764
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Freelance photo - journalist
    Location:
    Southport
    But note that there has never been a 99.72 class in the German narrow gauge systems. The current 99.72xx are actually 99.23 class (99.231-247) developed from the prototype 99.22 class (99.221-223) but in post WWII days the DR elected to prefix serial numbers with a digit indicating the gauge of the operating line hence the HSB fleet gaining "7" to become 99.7231-7247 whilst 99.222 has been operated as both 99.222 and 99.7222 by the HSB. If you look at images in the book (linked to above) you will note some images of the Class 99.23 locos having a "0" digit to denote oil-firing but when oil-firing was removed in the 1980s the digit reverted to "7". The current operation of 99.236 in its DDR guise, however, does not include the the leading "0" digit or the fitting of oil-firing AFAIK.

    Thinking back to your earlier query re 99.600 / 610 it may be that the German "logic" simply added a trailing zero thus 99.60 becoming 99.600 and 99.61 becoming 99.610 as the 2-digit sub group had already been used. This would also follow some computer logics - especially where numbers as defined simply as characters rather than numerics hence class sequence being character order 60 600 61 610 rather than numeric order 60 61 600 610.
     
  12. worldsteam

    worldsteam New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2006
    Messages:
    176
    Likes Received:
    29
    In case anyone off soon, the emergency TT on Selketalbahn has been replaced from today (8th July) with a different emergency TT. There was little notice of this change.

    I think the old was better, with two returns to Eisfelder T. The new has no steam at all on the 0830 Quedlinburg, so Stiege Loop no longer sees steam and the possible parallel departure out of Eisfelder (which was erratic anyhow) is no more.

    99.7237 did the last 0830 yesterday. The parallel departure looked likely, except 99.7243 on the Nordhausen was poorly and crew trying to fix (without success), so eventually 99.7237 left ahead. Fitters were at Drei Annen Hohne to meet 99.7243 and seemed to do the trick, but it was taken off the Nordhausen duty with 99.7240 taking charge and 99.7243 took the Wernigerode duty.

    Busy day today with two specials up Brocken. 99.5902 + 99.5901 ready for one and the ecs to Gernrode yesterday for the special from there was 99.7235. So 13 steam trains up Brocken today.

    David
     
  13. 5944

    5944 Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2006
    Messages:
    4,122
    Likes Received:
    736
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Train Maintainer for FCC at Hornsey
    Location:
    Sandy
    Seems the whole of the system is currently shut due to flooding and storm damage. Yesterday there were no services from Schierke to the Brocken, but now it appears there are no services at all.
     
  14. 30854

    30854 Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2017
    Messages:
    757
    Likes Received:
    687
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Brighton&Hove
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Wir sind glücklich, dass Klimaveränderung an der Wahlurne ignoriert werden kann.

    If a post in my appalling German annoys you, trust me when I say that the translated sentiment would annoy you an awful lot more.
     
  15. 5944

    5944 Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2006
    Messages:
    4,122
    Likes Received:
    736
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Train Maintainer for FCC at Hornsey
    Location:
    Sandy
    Hasserode looks a bit wet! Services should resume between Nordhausen and Ifield tomorrow, but no announcement about the rest of the network. FB_IMG_1501069295745.jpg
     
  16. mickpop

    mickpop Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2010
    Messages:
    4,093
    Likes Received:
    2,228
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Cheshire
    Not really related to this thread but would any German orientated enthusiasts be interested in 10 years worth [1980s to late 90s] of the German language magazine 'Lok Report'? I'm reducing my collection due to space considerations. Free to collect in Cheshire or North Wales or I can deliver in the North West/North Wales.
     
  17. Saint

    Saint New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2017
    Messages:
    25
    Likes Received:
    29
    Occupation:
    Software Engineer
    Location:
    Padova
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Very nice job indeed!
     

Share This Page