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Best British Locomotive

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by Hermod, May 12, 2017.

  1. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    The limitation on sustained output on all our steam locos is the fireman. It doesn't matter how big the cylinders or how big the boiler. Even with two people firing, as often happens nowadays, there's a practical limit to how much you can shovel through the firehole door. At 2 ton/hr and an overall efficiency of say 7% that's going to come out at about 1600hp. Pushing that to 3 ton/hr will give 2400hp but that tenderful of coal will soon need replenishing
    And the not inconsiderable power required to drag the locomotive itself up any sort of gradient. For 140 ton loco on a 1 in 100 gradient at 75 mph, that's 626 hp according to my slide rule. Diesel or steam.
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2017
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  2. Hermod

    Hermod New Member

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    The tester diesel must be ballasted to Tornado mass.
    If Tornado boiler and,blastpipe is like V2 ,2.5 tons coal per hr is max rate that can evaporate water, and gives 1990 indicated horsepower.
    The LMS is 2.7 tons and 2550 ihp.
    One hour/one fireman indicated horsepower is 1615 on LNER and 1480 on LMS
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2017
  3. Allegheny

    Allegheny New Member

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    For a Diesel-electric locomotive the efficiency of the transmission will not be greater than about 85%, maybe less.
     
  4. Hermod

    Hermod New Member

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    All this diesel Tornado ton talk from me is because I have a Question:
    Can a more or less max power british steam locomotive pull a worthwhile load fast enough on mainlines without causing problems for other trains?
    It has been proved beyond doubt, that it can run a ton.
    But for how long and how loaded.
    A diesel of say 2000crankhorsepower ,that can run a ton,who got a pseudo tender so that mass and air resistance equalled the Tornado can simulate fast steam mainline excursions.
    If steam mainline becomes a nuissance I offer the advice(without being payed or asked for advice)that Settle Carisle can be a world beater for scenic steam railwaying.
    If this happens I have an idea for a better steam locomotive.
    Thank You for reading ,objecting and answering.
    That LMS pacific picture alone has made it worthwhile.
     
  5. Allegheny

    Allegheny New Member

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    If it is simply a question of power then you could double head, but there are all sorts of other mechanical stresses that need to be considered for high speed running.

    There was a discussion on this forum a while ago that some combinations of locomotives were not permitted to double head. I've had a look, but I can't find it.
     
  6. R.W. Grant

    R.W. Grant New Member

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    At least to me, for as great as they are, the Black Five locos are not world beaters but when Riley's 5's are doubleheaded they are certainly something to behold! They seem to define power.
     
  7. Copper-capped

    Copper-capped Member

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    For favourite passenger loco I would choose GWR Saint. For freight, also GWR, 72xx 2-8-2t...such a beast! There was also an excellent shout earlier for City of Truro with Indian red frames. Nice.

    If I had to go out of my comfort zone so to speak, there are any number of southern tank engines that tickle my fancy in a weird sort of way. I would be hard pressed to narrow it down to a single class. :)
     
  8. mickpop

    mickpop Part of the furniture

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    It is not always necessary to be big to be beautiful. I rather like these attractive little Bagnall built narrow gauge 'W' Class 0-6-2s built for Indian Railways

    wbilimora2.jpg
     
  9. Chris86

    Chris86 Member

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    Prettiest- 780 'Alice' ......


    Chris
     
  10. andykeithharris

    andykeithharris New Member

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    To me the best British loco, certainly as an all rounder was the 9F, which could handle just about anything that is thrown at it and with nicely balanced looks.

    Given that looks are in the eye of the beholder I also quite like the Ivatt/Standard 4 Moguls

    Andy
     
  11. 30567

    30567 Active Member Friend

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    I spent a couple of hours looking at the difference between a schedule with a max of 75 and one with a max of 90, together with Tornado's water economy. Given the way fast trains are flighted on the East Coast Main Line the difference is appreciable. With a max of 90 and a single stop at Grantham , London-York in under four hours becomes possible. For the foreign tourist market this then becomes an attraction in the 'iconic day out' category. I think that's the market Mr Bunker is after.
     
  12. The Black Hat

    The Black Hat Active Member

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  13. sir gilbert claughton

    sir gilbert claughton New Member

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    Lime-Street Station  c1890.jpg



    Lime ST Station C 1890 Lady of the Lake
     
  14. sir gilbert claughton

    sir gilbert claughton New Member

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    124298046.jpg



    best loco needs to encompass reliability , usefulness , route availability, and economy . easy on the eye helps as well . that excludes pretty much anything over class 5 , so I offer the Modified Hall courtesy of Mr Hawksworth
     
  15. maddog

    maddog New Member

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    Route availability...?
     
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  16. 30854

    30854 Active Member

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    Good where platforms are wide enough! :cool:
     
  17. 30854

    30854 Active Member

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    For sheer value for money and longevity, GS&WR/GSR/CIE Class 101. Allegedly related to the old Ramsbottom LNWR DX Goods, they were introduced 1866 and lasted in numbers until the end of regular (Southern) Irish timetabled steam services in 1963. Even then, a handful are recorded as not being withdrawn until 1965, including No.104 of 1874. That's "Fenchurch" territory! One solitary example, No.118 of 1891 made it into 1966. With a maximum axle load of around 12 tons, there weren't that many places they couldn't go. Two are preserved.
    GS%26WR_No_186_in_Preservation.jpg.cf.jpg
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2017
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  18. andrewshimmin

    andrewshimmin Active Member

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    Fantastic photo! What beauties those LoL/Problems were.
     
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  19. LMS2968

    LMS2968 Well-Known Member

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    They had a long life too. Apparently F.W. Webb was the Chief Draghtsman and was responsible for much of the design. He was quite attached to them, and instead of withdrawal when they became time expired had them rebuilt to give them another lease of life.
     
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  20. Cartman

    Cartman Member

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    Best British loco. LMS Duchess. Might as well lock the thread, can't be topped!
     
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