If you register, you can do a lot more. And become an active part of our growing community. You'll have access to hidden forums, and enjoy the ability of replying and starting conversations.

Churchward County Project

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by aron33, Feb 9, 2018.

  1. MellishR

    MellishR Resident of Nat Pres Friend

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Messages:
    8,068
    Likes Received:
    5,165
    Were there shortcomings other than somewhat rough riding due to the combination of large outside cylinders and short wheelbase? That particular aspect shouldn't be a problem on a 25 mph line, and taking this loco on the main line seems unlikely. In principle it could be used as a pilot loco or there might be some situation where a short train is viable, but those uses are unlikely to be frequent enough to justify the considerable expense of fitting out and approval for the main line.
     
  2. Jimc

    Jimc Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2005
    Messages:
    4,052
    Likes Received:
    4,665
    Occupation:
    Once computers, now part time writer I suppose.
    Location:
    SE England
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    What shortcomings do you suppose could be addressed? Unless the locomotive is completely redesigned from top to bottom - or at least front to back - there's nothing much that could be done about the riding, which will be an irrelevance at preserved line speeds anyway. OK arguably the standard 4 grate/firebox was a bit on the small side, but that will be if anything a virtue at 25mph. Cook says the rough riding and the amount of reciprocal balance needed in just 4 wheels tended to make them wear the l/h rear axlebox, and that they tended to need works attention after only 40,000 miles, (which was very low for a Churchward locomotive), but will any of this be relevant at 25mph on heritage line duties?
     
  3. LesterBrown

    LesterBrown Member

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2009
    Messages:
    995
    Likes Received:
    761
    Location:
    Devon
    The short wheelbase being a problem I can quite understand. But a lot has been said about the balancing the reciprocating masses of 30" stroke cylinders over just 2 axles and yet I have never heard that the Scott atlantics had any riding problems and were freer running than the comparative 4-6-0s.

    Hopefully at some time in the future a comparison with 191 "Churchward" will be possible.
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2018
  4. Kinghambranch

    Kinghambranch Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2006
    Messages:
    1,868
    Likes Received:
    1,588
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    White Rose County
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    A link to the "County" Website is here in case anyone's missed it. I enjoyed reading it and found it very interesting and well-presented. Perhaps I'm just easily impressed by anything GWR! That said, these 4-4-0s do look a bit out of proportion to me.
    www.churchwardcounty.org.uk/
     
    aron33 likes this.
  5. 240P15

    240P15 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2017
    Messages:
    1,598
    Likes Received:
    1,588
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Norway
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer

    To me, the very big driving wheels ,boggi in front ,and inside valve gear give them a look that reminds me of the very typichal old american 2-2-0 engines. These you can see in many cartoon movies;)

    [​IMG]
    picture from wikipedia commons

    Knut:)
     
  6. Greenway

    Greenway Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2008
    Messages:
    3,906
    Likes Received:
    3,704
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    South Hams
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    4-4-0 in USA Knut, :D but great locomotives which enabled the conquest of the prairies and beyond - east to west, north and south and vice versa. These locos helped build America.
     
    240P15 likes this.
  7. Cartman

    Cartman Well-Known Member Account Suspended

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2015
    Messages:
    2,290
    Likes Received:
    1,672
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Van driver
    Location:
    Cheshire
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Wasn’t there a suggestion a few years ago that the NRM were going to borrow an American 4-4-0 for a time?

    (Hands up who would like to see one lug 6 mark 1s up the S & C?!)
     
  8. 240P15

    240P15 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2017
    Messages:
    1,598
    Likes Received:
    1,588
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Norway
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer

    Thanks for correcting me sir. :)
     
  9. GWR4707

    GWR4707 Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    May 12, 2006
    Messages:
    18,046
    Likes Received:
    15,735
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Cumbria
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    As the design of the County's coincided with the period that Churchward was being heavily influenced by American ideas, I suspect there many be some manner of ancestral relationship?

    There is a very interesting piece in the GWS Echo this quarter regarding the County's plus introducing the project.
     
  10. Cartman

    Cartman Well-Known Member Account Suspended

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2015
    Messages:
    2,290
    Likes Received:
    1,672
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Van driver
    Location:
    Cheshire
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Good luck to them I say. They do appear to have quite a few components, the boiler being a huge start, also the wheel patterns for the Saint, plus some other bits and a tender frame. Power class C according to the spec on the website so reasonably powerful for its size. Personally, I prefer the later curved front framing
     
    BrightonBaltic likes this.
  11. Greenway

    Greenway Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2008
    Messages:
    3,906
    Likes Received:
    3,704
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    South Hams
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Knut having had a great interest in the SNCF and building an HO model railway based on SNCF practice I got used to the UIC notation for loco wheels. It took a while to get into the more familiar, in the UK, Whyte version. ;)
     
    240P15 likes this.
  12. GWR4707

    GWR4707 Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    May 12, 2006
    Messages:
    18,046
    Likes Received:
    15,735
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Cumbria
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Looks exciting and more importantly organised as a project..
     
    240P15 likes this.
  13. GWR4707

    GWR4707 Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    May 12, 2006
    Messages:
    18,046
    Likes Received:
    15,735
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Cumbria
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    You will be pleased then as that's how they are building her! ;)
     
    Cartman likes this.
  14. 240P15

    240P15 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2017
    Messages:
    1,598
    Likes Received:
    1,588
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Norway
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    I am also a big fan of French steam so i guess that explain my 2-2-0 "mistake".:)
     
    Greenway likes this.
  15. 1472

    1472 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2008
    Messages:
    1,898
    Likes Received:
    2,517
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Really? - where are the resources coming from to build this locomotive?

    If its a 100% paid job then why would it go to Toddington rather than one of the few contractors who could take the job on?

    If its a GWS attempt to tap into other folks resources because their own can't cope with the projects they have already then surely in this case that will be to the detriment of the home GWSR fleet?

    Will it generate a whole army of new volunteers? - possible yes but that really doesn't look very likely if past form is anything to go by.

    Personally I don't get it - sorry.
     
  16. Jimc

    Jimc Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2005
    Messages:
    4,052
    Likes Received:
    4,665
    Occupation:
    Once computers, now part time writer I suppose.
    Location:
    SE England
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    AIUI its basically a new project. They'll form their own team and fund raising I presume, but if they manage to get far enough then again AIUI the GWS will pass on the various items they've put together for a County.
     
    ghost and flying scotsman123 like this.
  17. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2013
    Messages:
    10,440
    Likes Received:
    17,941
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Cheltenham
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    I'm not a volunteer at Toddington so may be seeing it wrong but I don't think it'll impact on current loco department activities. Bearing in mind most locos have their own teams anyway as they're all privately owned by groups they're unlikely to drift away. Resources like our machine shop being used won't affect the rest of the department's activities, and the undercover space issue is being dealt with as mentioned right at the beginning of the thread, by them putting some money towards an already planned shed extension.
     
    Gav106 likes this.
  18. Andy B

    Andy B Member

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2007
    Messages:
    477
    Likes Received:
    585
    Location:
    Bristol
    There’s certainly enough to keep us busy, the shed extension will be welcome. The 4 road shed houses both the working engines and the restoration/overhaul activities.
    2807 is out at the end of 2019, 76077 has been started with 3850’s overhaul on going.
    It’s thankful that the board are investing in the dept by building a brand new facilities block to cater for the growing numbers in the dept. Currently Seating at Lunch time on a Wednesday or Saturday is a lottery !
     
    jnc and Kinghambranch like this.
  19. Reading General

    Reading General Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    May 18, 2011
    Messages:
    6,081
    Likes Received:
    2,217
    I look forward to seeing progress although I think it was a mistake to display 5227, they should have dismantled it straight away. As you can tell I'm not altogether comfortable with dismembering locos to make others.
     
    1472, Kylchap, 30854 and 1 other person like this.
  20. Kinghambranch

    Kinghambranch Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2006
    Messages:
    1,868
    Likes Received:
    1,588
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    White Rose County
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    You may be seeing it wrong. All I can say is that our 2807 group would find things like winter maintenance more difficult if it weren't for other members of the GWSR loco Dept's assistance. The GWSR Loco Blog gives some good examples of this.
     

Share This Page